The internet is full of nonsense ‘cures’ for cancer. Don’t be taken in

When given a diagnosis of cancer, most people understandably go into some sort of mental shock. The prospect of many months of aggressive treatments reducing their quality of life to almost zero is hard to bear. What is worse is that this ordeal is not even a guarantee of a cure but might merely increase the chances of survival.

Before consenting to go through with all this, most patients therefore look elsewhere in order to find out for themselves what their options are. It would be foolish to simply accept what the team of health care professionals have been saying. With decisions as important as this one, it is wise to listen to second and possibly third opinions. Who would argue with this logic?

Many cancer patients thus go on the internet and have a look at what alternatives are on offer. There they would find virtually millions of websites advertising plenty of seemingly ‘good news’. Many claim that a wide variety of alternative therapies cures cancer; anything from colloidal silver to special diets, and from homeopathy to vitamin C.

A patient might, for instance, find an article entitled: ‘Cancer Treatments The Media Never Talks About Could Save Your Life!’ If she does, her life is not saved; on the contrary, it is at serious risk.
You think I am exaggerating? In this case, let me quote from this website (I made no changes other than abbreviating the passage):

… cancer is a microbial disease, not a DNA disease… the DNA damage in cancer cells is caused by the DNA of the microbes which are inside the cancer cells. This was discovered by the Virginia Livingston team of natural medicine researchers…

Sometimes treatments can and should be combined. For example, a High RF Frequency device (which reverts cancer cells into normal cells and also kills the microbes in the organs and bloodstream) and the Dirt Cheap Protocol (which includes treatments that primarily revert cancer cells into normal cells). This is arguably the most potent cancer treatment on this website because there is so much redundancy in accomplishing the things that are needed to survive cancer. For example, the High RF Frequency device kills microbes and parasites in the organs. However, it is a fairly expensive protocol. Its focus is on reverting cancer cells into normal cells and supercharging the immune system, but a few of the items do kill cancer cells.

People are sometimes shocked at the attitude of some cancer researchers who have little interest in killing cancer cells. But why kill cancer cells when it is so easy to revert them into normal cells or let the immune system kill them?

However, many of the natural medicine protocols do safely kill cancer cells or they include protocols that kill cancer cells and revert cancer cells into normal cells.

For example, the Cellect-Budwig is designed to safely kill cancer cells, build the immune system (so the immune system can kill the cancer cells) and energize weak cells. Also the High RF Frequency Device – Plasma, which reverts cancer cells into normal cells and kills microbes and parasites in the organs, is frequently used with the Cellect-Budwig protocol…

If you thought that this is an extreme example of irresponsible, life-threatening misinformation, you would be mistaken. The internet is full of such articles promoting treatments for which there is no good evidence, frequently encouraging patients to forego conventional treatments which might save their lives. If someone then dares to point out the dangers of following bogus advice, he will in all likelihood get attacked for being in the pocket of ‘Big Pharma’.

And it gets worse!

Some of us have a healthy scepticism towards dubious entrepreneurs and might therefore focus on information issued by a charitable organisation. After all, charities have a reputation of not being commercially orientated and doing their best to help desperate cancer patients. Sadly, however, this sector is contaminated with misinformation of the worst kind. Take, for instance, the Cancer Alternative Foundation, an organisation that states:

The Cancer Alternative Foundation is a not-for-profit educational organisation, established in 2013 to explore effective alternative and traditional medicine treatments for cancer. Our research team identifies alternative cancer treatment options, then investigates them through meta-analysis across many fields of study. We are not alone in our understanding of the superior effectiveness of natural means to heal the body from cancer…

This sort of prevarication is not just misleading, it is dangerous and arguably even criminal. To make myself perfectly clear: there currently is no alternative therapy that will cure any type of cancer, and there will never be one either.

Even the idea of an alternative cancer cure is nonsensical. It suggests that cancer specialists would withhold life-saving treatments from their patients simply because they originated from a different tradition. The simple truth is that, as soon as any therapy shows some promise, it will be swiftly investigated by conventional scientists and doctors. If it then turns out to be successful, the treatment will be used as soon as possible for the benefit of cancer sufferers. Oncologists really do not care a hoot whether their medicines come from nature or from a factory. In fact, some of our best and most-used anti-cancer drugs initially came from the plant kingdom — think of Taxol, for instance.

I feel strongly that I need to keep banging on about these issues. Why? Because warning patients of the many irresponsible snake-oil salesmen who merely want to exploit the most vulnerable for their own financial gain can save lives. Cancer sufferers and their friends and relatives need to be informed that alternative cancer ‘cures’ are a contradiction in terms.

Edzard Ernst, emeritus professor at the University of Exeter, is the author of A Scientist in Wonderland and the awardee of the John Maddox Prize 2015 for standing up for science. He blogs at edzardernst.com.


  • Geoffmd

    CBD oil, Turmeric, Lycopene, Acai etc….are they “snake oils” errr NO…typical zombie attitude by the press as per usual when most of the general public are starting to wake up the the big pharma cancer scam…

    • Marianne Baker

      Yes, yes they are. If they’re being sold to you as cures they absolutely are. Ask for the evidence. Don’t just follow the old conspiracy theories – apart from anything else, it’s so hugely offensive. We are all affected by cancer. That’s all the people who treat it, research it, and make drugs for it. Everyone. There is absolutely not ‘more money in’ hiding cures – cancer is 100s of diseases, not one. It’s a bit complicated. Don’t assume you know better.
      https://noodlemaz.wordpress.com/2013/09/17/ask-for-evidence-miracle-cures/

      • Geoffmd

        They are NOT being sold to anyone as cures as its against the law in this country despite the proof of the effect of these things including some independent research that has been conducted by actual ethical scientists…If you wanna be a zombie and a slave to big Pharma be my guest no one is stopping you, funny how cancer is on the up and up despite trillions going on research and medicines….Yes I wonder why that is duh !!

        • Ieva Zagante

          Proof that high concentrations of turmeric kill cancer cells in petri dish? So does dishwashing liquid and even pure water. First do some calculations regarding the amount of turmeric you will have to eat to achieve experimental concentrations of curcuminoids, and then try to imagine eating that pile of turmeric every day….

          • Geoffmd

            See below taken from Cancer research UK….try doing some of your own research before spouting nonsense and making yourself look silly….

            A phase I clinical trial looked at giving curcumin to 25 patients with pre cancerous changes in different organs. This study seemed to show that curcumin could stop the precancerous changes becoming cancer.

            Research has also shown that there are low rates of certain types of cancer in countries where people eat curcumin at levels of about 100 to 200 mg a day over long periods of time.

            Read more at http://www.cancerresearchuk.org/about-cancer/cancers-in-general/cancer-questions/can-turmeric-prevent-bowel-cancer#hZulQi8viCSQBx0X.99

          • Ieva Zagante

            1. Precancerous lessions often do not become cancerous, so 25 patients is a ridiculous group. It must be very large, and even then, it won’t be any cause for definite statemets untill more information about genome and epigenome.
            2. Haven’t you asked why trial was designated as Phase I? Maybe because there are also Phase II and Phase III, so you should have read a little, about phase, before making statements.
            3. And low/high rates of some cancers in some regions is a known phenomenon. For example Japanese introduced stomach cancer screening. For god reasons. But are they writing articles that regular use of whatever lowers rate of stomach cancer?

          • Geoffmd

            Firstly its Lesions FFS….and Phenomenon? are you even being serious? take a hike your clearly a moron!

          • It’s ‘it’s’
            It’s ‘Are you…
            It’s ‘Take a hike, you’re clearly…

          • Geoffmd

            its f’ck off, your a pr;ck and your soft as sh8t you little key board warrior !! mong !

          • Acleron

            That’s sh8te, by the way.

          • Oh, I see! It’s acceptable for you to ridicule and insult others for their writing skills… but yours are untouchable – is that it?

          • Geoffmd

            exactly !

          • Acleron

            Woosh.

          • Acleron

            Almost everything kills cell cultures, the difficulty is in keeping the little blighters alive.

          • Copy that.

          • Michael McCarthy

            A fact that people that have actually worked with cell cultures understand, a fact that eludes people that will pull out an in vitro study as proof that x causes y.

          • omfgwtfbbq

            What about all the in vivo animal studies that show the same thing?

          • Geoffmd

            Actually the problem is absorbing into the blood stream which they are currently working on…some people dont like facts they prefer them to come with a GSK sticker on to make them feel better!

          • omfgwtfbbq

            The amount of THC and CBD they use to kill cancer in vitro are obtainable in the blood stream. Ingestion of 10grams of hashoil would put your THC levels up to around 2-3mg/L in the blood stream. IIRC, the invitro studies by cristina sanchez were using around 3mg/L of THC to kill cancer in vitro. These compounds have no toxic or negative affects on healthy cells; and there is a clinical study proving that.

      • Geoffmd
      • Geoffmd
        • ichthyic

          by default, anyone who cites “Natural News” must be a moron, since that site NEVER has any facts on offer. Instead, nothing but misinformation designed to sell “natural” products.

          the guy who runs it is as evil as evil can be.

          • Geoffmd

            So your denying that governments have been continuously hoodwinked into panic buying vaccines for billions buy your so called ethical pharma companies and their scientific researchers? if you deny it they you need to be put to sleep before you harm other because your clearly a danger to society….

          • Matthew Brignall, ND

            It’s “you’re.”
            #spellcheckingapersonusingviolentlanguage

          • morpheus1994

            Totally untrue, as Mike Adams often cites his references, and many are actually from JAMA, BMJ, and other reputable sources. This is a typical ad hominem attack. Attack the man and not what he is saying. I’ve never seen anyone get sick from a prescription drug deficiency…

            Just a question. Would you say that the only treatment for any disease MUST be a drug? That’s what the American medical authorities have made into law. Does that sound like an open, scientific attitude towards treatment methods?

          • James Peters
          • AutismDadd

            What rubbish. Science based medicine an industry site.

          • tomonthebay

            Adams IS a nut job and SBM provides verifiable, scientific supportable information. The exact opposite of what is found on Adam’s site.

          • AutismDadd

            Quit lying. Adams back it up with sources, unlike you.

          • tomonthebay

            Adams doesn’t back up anything. He is a liar and a fraud.

          • AutismDadd

            I see you didn’t back up your allegations. Too funny

      • Geoffmd
      • Vladimir Stanescu

        Conspiracy theories ? In my opinion, it’s mostly stupidity, laziness and mercantilism. I am talking about the conventional brainwashed doctors, obviously.

  • Acleron

    ‘I feel strongly that I need to keep banging on about these issues. ‘

    It is fortunate that you do and regrettable that your fellow doctors, with some honourable exceptions, are not more vocal in condemning this despicable trade in human misery.

    The arrogance and sheer stupidity of the quacks’ supporters in trying to claim that researchers are not interested in the more plausible claims about certain herbal remedies is staggering.

    • AutismDadd

      I imagine you know a lot about staggering

    • jerry hamilton

      Just. how strongly do you feel you need to bang your head on the doors of Snake Oil salesmen?
      If you do, start with the original charlatans who removed natural remedies which had worked for thousands of years and made them illegal.
      Rockefeller and Carnegie the thieving crooks.

      • James Peters
        • jerry hamilton

          Thank you.
          That their way in was through medical universities is well known.
          Medical institutes in America at that time were a total mess and not difficult to take control of.
          Universities that converted to chemicals were well funded.
          This looks like a deviation from the known history but saying that, I have further reading to do.
          There is a very definite financial reason that the medical abilities of doctors were outlawed at that time by the American government.
          Excuse me, I have more to read before I can answer further.

        • AutismDadd

          Why does it lie like a rug?

        • AutismDadd

          Block or down vote James Peters

      • Acleron

        When you have any evidence to discuss, please come back.

        • jerry hamilton

          You too. Until then go bang the corrupt chemical drum.

          • Acleron

            I’m not the one making any claims, that’s you, so where is your evidence?

            The evidence that shows you are wrong are the natural remedies that work, they are called medicine.

          • jerry hamilton

            You sound like many government or big pharma sites.
            You can not be so blind as to not be aware that more people die from Kemo than from cancer.
            How do you think the stats are so good for cancer?
            Infact don’t tell me.
            I want no more of your corporate head banging.

          • Acleron

            What is the relationship between your comment on natural remedies and chemotherapy?

          • jerry hamilton

            Zero.
            Kemo, while killing any cell it comes into contact with, will give you cancer.

          • Acleron

            OK we have established your assertions about natural medicines are baseless.

            There is a major logical flaw in your latest argument.

          • jerry hamilton

            My assertions about natural medicines are based on thousands of years of healing.
            I expect big pharma to call it baseless.

          • Acleron

            You have failed to provide any evidence for that claim.

          • jerry hamilton

            And you have majestically proved your inability to research to an extent such that, that was your last post to me.

          • Acleron

            You show that not only are you not a researcher but you have little idea of the concept of learning. It involves the evidence that you continue to show you cannot provide.

          • jerry hamilton

            Such is the ultimate loser post?
            Can you really not see the history of medicine trashed by your government or do you just want to see it?
            All the ways of the ancients destroyed by a charlatan like you for what?????
            So you can attempt to prove a corrupt government right?
            Please don’t reply, you are pathetic for what you are attempting to do.
            Life did exist before Rockefeller and his money making ways for everyone except you that is.
            Evidence proven by life on earth.

          • Acleron

            If you could show some evidence for your claim I can consider it but so far all you have is conspiracy theory.

            Yes life did exist before modern medicine, it was brutish and short.

            It may be uncomfortable to have to try to prove your claims or be shown to have no evidential support for them but that’s life, so I’ll stay here showing that you cannot find any facts despite your insults.

          • AutismDadd

            So what does modern medicine do for the 8,000,000 who die of starvation each year? And “ignore them” isn’t an answer.

          • Acleron

            Duddy boy demonstrates he has no evidence and not much intelligence.

          • AutismDadd

            So YOU can’t answer the question.

          • tomonthebay

            As pointed out, it is a silly question as mass starvation is not an issue for modern medicine.

          • AutismDadd

            Correct. They don’t give a damn.

          • tomonthebay

            Food distribution has ZERO relationship to modern medicine. Apples and zebras. Not even close enough to be apples and oranges.

          • AutismDadd

            Buh Wah Ha Ha says the minion who says because vaccines alter the spread of illness, injury and death are quite alright.

          • tomonthebay

            Buh Wah Ha Ha says the fool who doesn’t understand that vaccines are far safer than getting the diseases they prevent.

          • James Peters

            In my view AutismDadd is a troll. The best thing to do is down vote, ignore, report and block if needs be.

          • AutismDadd

            Buh Wah Ha Ha, in other words I’m so effective you want to Wakefield me.

          • john tucci

            We don’t block AutismDadd, we keep him around for laughs.

          • AlexanderAmproz

            Middel-Ages pandemics weren’t cured by helpful vaccines,
            but MOSTLY by Hygiene !

          • tomonthebay

            False.

          • AlexanderAmproz

            Keep your believes and go to live in a Third World
            squatters area without sewages, tap water and soap,
            alike it was all over European Cities during the Middle-Ages

            Read the Cholera vaccine history, the major discovery
            was to avoid contamination, viruses were undiscovered
            at that times…

            Wash regularly your hands is the best you can do,
            to avoid vaccines, injections, or medicines.

            An Healthy diversified food is needed too
            for the immune system efficiency.
            Lack and bad food with hygiene absence, TB, Cholera,
            and al in Auschwitz killed more than the gas chambers

          • AutismDadd

            tom, doing his joepharmer act. ZERO evidence, just a one word grunt out.

          • Acleron

            A) Little hygiene in the Middle Ages, they used middens and lived in houses whose walls contained dung.
            B) Epidemics resolved when the vulnerable had died and the rest were supported by herd immunity until the birth rate had diluted herd immunity and the disease was reintroduced.

          • AlexanderAmproz

            It’s look you have a toilettes broom for brain….

          • Acleron

            Oh dear, another one who cannot debate facts.

          • AlexanderAmproz

            I already followed your blabbering’
            and I am not interested !
            ===========================
            jerry hamilton Acleron 2 days ago

            Please. Pretty please, just take all your love for big pharma and shove it where the sun don’t shine.

            I have had it with government siko’s.

            Please. Don’t reply you slck fck.

          • Acleron

            I’ll question any claims made without evidence, you obviously have problems dealing with that. You will continue to have problems.

          • AutismDadd

            Alex said he wasn’t interested in debating a sick fck.

          • Acleron

            Like you, it is more that he cannot debate anything.

          • tomonthebay

            Exactly.

          • AutismDadd

            There is little to debate. 19 countries have conceded vaccines maim and kill.

          • Verna Lang

            People keep telling you that vaccine injuries are real but occur rarely. But you insist that they are common. Let’s see whether you will believe a team of vaccine injury lawyers have to say about vaccine reactions, because why would they lie about their source of income?
            Search: “List of the top vaccine injuries-Urban & Taylor” for a complete list of what they will pursue as injuries.

            Let’s see their description of the most common vaccines and their injuries:

            “DTaP. This vaccine is for Diphtheria, Tetanus, and acellular Pertussis. This vaccine also has a small chance of injury. Mild symptoms are fevers, swelling, tenderness, and no appetites. Moderate symptoms, which are less common, are seizures, fevers, and non-stop crying. The rarest severe symptoms may include comas and permanent brain damage.

            HPV-Gardasil-9. Mild and moderate reactions are soreness, redness, fever, and headaches.

            Influenza (Inactivated). Flu shots can cause fever, headache, itching, soreness, redness, and itchy eyes.

            MMR. This vaccine for Measles, Mumps, and Rubella can cause mild symptoms of fever, rash, and swollen glands. Moderate symptoms are seizures, temporary pain or a low platelet count.

            Polio. There aren’t many side effects for this vaccine, but it still has the common possibility for tenderness or redness around the area of the shot.”

            Wow. That looks like even the vaccine injury lawyers can’t agree with your vaccines “kill and maim” routinely. Lots of the use of the words rare and rarest there.

          • AutismDadd

            Buh Wah Ha Ha you expect lawyers to make claims they could be sued over? Hilarious. They are using published information that comes from Vaccine proponents. PRICELESS!!!!

          • tomonthebay

            What is priceless is your complete failure to understand the signifance of what Verna posted.

          • AutismDadd

            Which is??

          • Verna Lang

            I hope you don’t own a handgun, Duddy. With the accuracy you have with the written word, you will literally and frequently be shooting yourself in the foot.
            According to the Burdette Law firm, which is another firm that files vaccine injury claims:“You may also be entitled to compensation for injuries not on the Vaccine Injury Table.
            You will need to consult with a knowledgeable attorney if you have what we call an “off-table
            injury.””

            Clearly, lawyers like this who are in the business of filing vaccine injury claims will not get sued for filing for something not on the Vaccine Injury Table. They will have to prove the injury was caused by vaccines, but if all sorts of people are getting “maimed and killed” by vaccines like you claim, that should be easy to prove. Your whole argument that because vaccine compensation programs exist, therefore vaccines are too dangerous to use is not based on reality.

          • AutismDadd

            Logic fail as usual. Blah blah, as usual.

          • Verna Lang

            Ahhh, you poor deary. You would not recognize logic if it grew teeth and bit you on the source of your ‘information.’

          • AutismDadd

            Nice deflection Verna.

          • Verna Lang

            Deflection. Yet another word you have redefined into something not found in any dictionary.

          • AutismDadd

            So VERNA once again makes an invalid statement that the word deflection is not found in a dictionary. Credibility ZERO

          • Acleron

            You really should take one of those remedial classes in english.

          • AutismDadd

            Why when there is no need. I think Verna and you need it more.

          • Acleron

            Because your understanding of simple English is deficient.

          • AutismDadd

            Boring

          • Acleron

            Thinking is one of those skills that you haver never been able to show, especially as you were unable to comprehend what Verna Lang said. Go take a class, you might be able to keep up.

          • AutismDadd

            haver? Buh Wah Ha Ha

          • sabelmouse

            they certainly do!

          • Verna Lang

            So Duddy once again displays his lack of reading comprehension. Your definition of deflection, not the word itself, is not found in any dictionary. The subject was logic. I replied that your source of logic was suspect. No deviation or change of topic. Therefore, no deflection. Look it up in your Funk and Wagnalls. Inability to reason: infinite.

          • AutismDadd

            To DEFLECT criticism. Oh my that was easy!

          • Verna Lang

            Deflection as used in arguments or conversation is changing the topic. I didn’t deflect. I negated your criticism on the grounds that you have no acquaintance with the concept of logic.

          • AutismDadd

            Hilarious. You changed the subject from vaccines to logic. If you had a clue it would be lonely.

          • Verna Lang

            You should consider having yourself checked for dementia. Short-term memory loss is a symptom. After all, it has only been two days since you wrote: “Logic fail as usual” as an attempt at a rebuttal to a comment I made that was well supported by evidence. Who changed the subject to logic, Duddy? It wasn’t me.
            You should get those feet looked at, too. They are must be riddled with bullet holes by now.

          • AutismDadd

            Now you want to talk about feet? Calling something a logic fail doesn’t changed the subject.

          • Verna Lang

            Hmmmm. A definite indication of short-term memory loss. It has been only 4 days since I wrote “I hope you don’t own a handgun, Duddy. With the accuracy you have with the written word, you will literally and frequently be shooting yourself in the foot.”
            Evaluation for dementia required.

          • AutismDadd

            I ignore and thank goodness, forget most of what you say. Its called a BLESSING. Look it up in the dictionary.

          • Verna Lang

            Sounds like a learning disability, not a blessing. There is help for that, too.

          • AutismDadd

            Help as in blocking Verna

          • Peter Harris

            Seems like your modus operandi, is to insult and belittle.
            So your complaints to me, are hollow at best, and grossly hypocritical at worst.

          • Verna Lang

            The complaint still stands.
            You have yet to address how I lied when I gave a direct quote from vaccine injury lawyers. Are you trying to say I made up the quote? It can easily be checked as true. The law firms? They exist. Or are you just upset that the quote from those personal injury lawyers means that ADudd’s repeated contention that the very existence of vaccine injury compensation means that vaccines “maim and kill” is an argument that only works in his imagination?
            And since you so kindly left so many quotes from years ago and from less than reliable sources, here’s one from a recent article in Nature 16 OCTOBER 2018 titled:
            The biggest pandemic risk? Viral misinformation

            I predict that the next major outbreak — whether of a highly fatal strain of influenza or something else — will not be due to a lack of preventive technologies. Instead, emotional contagion, digitally enabled, could erode trust in vaccines so much as to render them moot. The deluge of conflicting information, misinformation and manipulated information on social media should be recognized as a global public-health threat.

            Recognize yourself? You are a “global public-health threat” delivering “emotional contagion.”

          • Peter Harris

            Of course you think the complaint still stands, because you are willful simpleton.

            It’s called lie by omission.

            You have deliberately ignored the outrageous nefarious criminal behaviour which has been systemically undertaken by the Pharmaceuticals / medical industrial complex.

            As Noam Chomsky once said, it takes great dedication to avoid the truth.

            And in this case, there is a mountain of evidence, that shows that the pharmaceutical/Medical industrial complex, is just a criminal outfit, designed purely to make money.

          • Acleron

            Harris is using Duddy Boy’s random response mode.

          • Peter Harris

            Ha ha Ha, your a master at deflecting, and going off on irrelevant tangents. You get a gold medal for hypocrisy.

          • tomonthebay

            Duddy has demostrated that there are a lot of words and concepts he doesn’t understand.

          • Peter Harris

            That’s true, the Internet is full of false claims from the pharmaceutical/medical industrial complex regarding a cure for cancer, claims they have made for decades, but up until 2018, they have proven themselves to be epic failures.

          • tomonthebay

            Another blatant lie.

          • Peter Harris

            My claim stands, because you haven’t refuted anything.

          • john tucci

            A friend of mine was diagnosed with Cancer in 2005 and thanks to modern medicine is alive today and doing well.

          • tomonthebay

            Verna’s statement is actually completely factual.

          • AutismDadd

            As if you’d know.

          • tomonthebay

            Actually, yes I do.

          • AutismDadd

            I see ZERO evidence. That can mean only one thing…case dismissed.

          • Acleron

            You have copiously demonstrated that what you see is immaterial.

          • AutismDadd

            Either it is or it isn’t.

          • Peter Harris

            Which part?

          • tomonthebay

            All of it. That is obvious to anyone with a brain.

          • Peter Harris

            In other words, true to form, you cannot provide some examples.

            And you just resort to your usual monosyllabic nonsense.

          • Peter Harris

            Still trolling your pharmaceutical/medical industrial complex propaganda?
            You have been proven in the past, to be a nefarious liar, and you should be banned from these forms.

          • Verna Lang

            The word is forum not form.
            Did you actually try to rebut my comment about what vaccine lawyers post on their websites about vaccine injury claims by resorting to insults? Failure of intellect detected.
            Wanting to censor me on a pro-medicine site speaks volumes about how pathetic you know your attempts to argue with me really are. Probably the only way you ever win any argument is by silencing the other side.

          • Peter Harris

            “The word is forum not form.”

            So the only complaint you have, first off, is that typo?
            I guess that says everything about your ability to stand up for your own arguments, and to rebut anything I say.

          • Peter Harris

            “Failure of intellect detected.”

            And when your propaganda is exposed, and your own intellectual failures to prosecute that propaganda, you resort to ad hominem and non sequiturs.

          • Peter Harris

            “Wanting to censor me on a pro-medicine site speaks volumes about how pathetic you know your attempts to argue with me really are.”

            No, quite the opposite, because in the past, when people put forward misanthropic theories and propaganda, they get banned.

            And as we stand in 2018, with the help of the Internet, the pharmaceutical/medical industrial complex has exposed.
            The greed, corruption and criminal behaviour of the pharmaceutical/medical industrial complex, where it kills hundreds of thousands each year, and doesn’t cure one person is now well documented.

            If this disgusting and nefarious behaviour was undertaken by other industries, it would be shut down.

          • Peter Harris

            “Did you actually try to rebut my comment about what vaccine lawyers post on their websites about vaccine injury claims by resorting to insults?”

            It’s not my argument to make, it’s your claim, therefore the onus of proof is on you.
            Where are lawyers not acting in their clients best interest?

            And there’s a consequence, that some of these lawyers are exposing the nefarious behaviour of the pharmaceutical/medical industrial complex, and somehow, you stamp your foot and complain about lawyers and conflict-of-interest.

            My god, your hypocrisy and wilful blindness is breath taking.

          • Peter Harris
          • Peter Harris

            When the general public wake up to the decades long greed, corruption and criminal behaviour within the pharmaceutical/medical industrial complex, they will be treated like any other industry in the past, that has undertaken such a disgusting modus operandi, will be held rightly as criminals, and therefore, people go to jail, and the industry shutdown, or at the very least, severely modified to reflect their real aim, which is to cure people, and not to make obscene profits at any cost.

            https://www.bmj.com/bmj/section-pdf/187741?path=/bmj/346/7894/Views_Reviews.full.pdf

          • Peter Harris

            “Within the health sector, pharmaceuticals stands out as sub-sector that is particularly prone to corruption. There are abundant examples globally that display how corruption in the pharmaceutical sector endangers positive health outcomes. Whether it is a pharmaceutical company bribing a doctor for prescribing its medicines irrespective of a health need or a government employee facilitating the infiltration of substandard medicines into the distribution system, public resources can be wasted and patient health put at risk.”

            https://www.transparency.org.uk/publications/corruption-in-the-pharmaceutical-sector/#.W9T6r9F_WhA

          • Peter Harris

            And I said, this has been going on for decades.

            This, from the 1980s…

            “The corrupt industry.
            Bribery and corruption, fraud in the testing of drugs, criminal
            negligence in the manufacture of drugs, dubious advertising claims –
            the pharmaceutical industry has a worse record of law breaking than any other industry.”

            https://newint.org/features/1986/11/05/corrupt

          • Acleron

            They incoherently scream censorship but the only requests to censor people comes from them.

          • tomonthebay

            Insults are part of Petey’s normal repertoire. He has little else to offer.

          • Peter Harris

            Again, the hypocrisy is off the scale.

            You two quacks have your history here to look through, and most of your posts are insulting and bullying, because you don’t have the medical knowledge or the intellectual rigour to mount a simple argument.

          • Thomas Mohr

            This is by far not the peak of what Peter Harris is capable of. We had a long discussion on naturopathy in cancer. He recommends his patients away from state of the art treatment to his own treatments – without presenting any data that these treatments actually work (which they likely do not). That might result in an at least two fold increased probability to die within 5 years (Johnson et al). At least twofold.

            When I pointed out to him that such a behavior violates his own code of ethics and likely the law applicable to naturopaths, fulfills the definition of medical fraud and might actually kill people, he threatened to fake child porn and send that faked pictures to my colleagues.

          • Verna Lang

            Why am I not surprised that he would sink to that level. Perhaps he has some investments in Big Funeral

          • Peter Harris

            Thomas Mohr is an outright sociopath, and a nefarious liar.

            Of course, you would believe anything he says.

            And I assume you don’t mind him trying to dox me, correct?

            People who try and dox other people on these forums and threads, only have one intention in mind.

            Anyhow, I’m reposting my response to you here, because on the previous thread, it was flagged as spam…

            A typical response from the cranks, on the extreme fringes of willful blindness within medical science.

            You take one and a half plus one and a half, and come up with 7 and 3/4.

            I said earlier, it’s not just improved plumbing, but improved sanitation and hygiene in many areas of society and the Urban environment, since the beginning of the industrial era.

            It’s improved sanitation within medical centres, and the ability to get clean potable water.

            You don’t understand a holistic approach, because you allopaths are entrenched in your reductionist thinking.

            For all their faults, the British Raj did introduce some basic hygiene measures, around the end of the Victorian era.

            “…nearly half their population who practice open defecation because…”

            Really now?

            And what do you base that on?

            That may have been the case a couple of decades ago, but when I was in the Punjab back in 2011, the Urban areas were very similar to Western countries, where you would see no one defecating in public.

            And while you consider answering that question, you can check these links out…

            “Dr. Lawrence Palevsky, well-respected pediatrician & fellow of American Academy of Pediatrics, discusses how disease mortality declined well before the introduction of vaccines.”

            https://www.learntherisk.or

            “And, in fact, before the inception of the measles vaccine (1963), from 1915-1958, a 95 percent decline took place in measles death rate (see figure 3).”

            https://www.jpands.org/haci

          • Verna Lang

            My bad. I didn’t look for a more recent update to the open defecation numbers. It is no longer nearly 50%. It is now down to 39% of the population or only about 600 million people.
            What do I base that information on? Fact checking. That does not mean assuming whether or not India has a sanitation problem based on one cursory look around an area you visited and declaring that it somehow represents an entire country.
            India started a PSA campaign in 2014 called “Take your poo to the loo.” The video is still up on Youtube and the campaign is still running in India. Why? Obviously, they still have a ways to go to get toilets that can contain fecal material available to everyone.
            Then there is this 2016 article: “Open Defecation in India: A Major Health Hazard and Hurdle in Infection Control” They mention deaths from fatal diarrhea. Diarrhea is the second leading cause of death in India. But no polio. I wonder why.

          • Peter Harris

            Yes, your bad…

            No comment from those links I sent you, that clearly showed that many diseases were close to being eradicated prior to vaccine implementation?

            I wonder why… to quote you.

          • Thomas Mohr

            Correct, aside that, the real value that counts is morbidity and not mortality. This did not decline that much.

          • Verna Lang

            Agreed. I saw the morbitity vs mortality PRATT. Refuting it a thousand and one times likely wouldn’t be effecive. Then I saw the jpands citation and realized just how deep a dive into the dumpster Peter is going to find the source of his information.

          • Peter Harris

            My word, the ignorance of yourself and others here, that includes trickery, cherry picking, and hair splitting is just on an Olympic level.

            Now you’re trying to find fault with the facts presented to you, by running an irrelevant argument up a non-existent flagpole.

            The links I had sent to you, both deal with the subject of mortality and morbidity.

            If it suited you, you would highlight mortality as an issue, where are other times, if it suits you, you would flip flop back to morbidity.

            Point is, you are nothing more than slippery eels, you, Mohr and others.

            The only level of competence that you display, are masterful renditions of obfuscation.

            And regarding my source, are you suggesting it comes from the bottom of a metaphorical dumpster?
            Is that your best criticism of the link?

            Of course, you failed miserably at actually confronting and arguing the facts presented in that link.

            And if you don’t regard http://www.jpands.org as a reliable source of medical information, then try and find fault with the British medical journal…

            “In 2007, readers of the British Medical Journal voted that the introduction of clean water and sewerage—the ‘sanitation revolution’ of the Victorian era—was the most important medical milestone since the 1840s, over anaesthesia, antibiotics, or vaccines.”

            https://adc.bmj.com/content/by/year

          • Verna Lang

            Did I say anywhere that sanitation and hygiene are not important in the fight against disease? Did you completely miss this last paragraph in my previous response to you?
            “Then there is this 2016 article: “Open Defecation in India: A Major Health Hazard and Hurdle in Infection Control” They mention deaths from fatal diarrhea. Diarrhea is the second leading cause of death in India. But no polio. I wonder why.”
            That article was all about the consequences of the lack of sanitation that India is struggling with. It is an enormous problem that will take time and the cooperation of the population.
            Prevention of disease cannot be done with just hygiene. Sewers and clean water cannot stop the spread of diseases by one infected person breathing out the same air that the other hundred or so people on a jet or an auditorium are breathing in. That is why vaccines are considered so valuable in fighting the spread of diseases. Otherwise, the EU would not be in the midst of a measles epidemic. It is certainly not from the sudden breakdown of their sewer and water infrastructure. It is from the breakdown of reason and a good helping of science denial from vaccine refusers.
            Jpands is a garbage journal that PubMed refuses to list. It is put out by an association of doctors known for refusing to take medical insurance payments. Apparently, if you can’t afford to pay cash, you can just curl up and die. Maybe you should apply for membership. They sound like your kind of people.

          • Peter Harris

            “Did I say anywhere that sanitation and hygiene are not important in the fight against disease?”

            Oh, now you’re saying it plays a role in disease reduction?

            Tell me more?

            Better watch your back, you might slip a disc with that flip flopping.

            “Did you completely miss this last paragraph in my previous response to you?”

            Not at all, I recall you admitted you got the statistics terribly wrong.

            And as for the rest of your emotional nonsense, I’ll just repeat, once again, that you and your ilk, are stuck in cherry picking reductionist nonsense arguments.

            And once you’ve made your feeble point, you add emotional nonsense at the end…

            “It is from the breakdown of reason and a good helping of science denial from vaccine refusers.”

            I’ll just reiterate, for the fact denies such as yourself, that since the dawn of the industrial age, a whole suite of environmental measures have helped contribute to the drastic reduction in diseases, whereas, vaccines that came very late in the picture, cannot be considered as eliminating the diseases, without due respect to the work done prior.

            “Jpands is a garbage journal that PubMed refuses to list.”

            😅😂😃😂😅😂

            That’s funny, because the sociopathic, and misanthropic Mohr refers to Jpands quite often.

            And your other obvious and pathetic back down, is that while you criticize Jpands, you didn’t actually criticize the facts presented in the article… why is that?

            Can you answer that?

            Without criticizing the source?

            And lastly, I see you dutifully avoided my link to the British Journal of Medicine, which backs up my argument, and destroys your cherry picked reductionist nonsense.

          • Verna Lang

            Let me guess. Your English teachers quit teaching after having you as a student. And it wasn’t because they didn’t try to teach you comprehension and literary devices like inference.
            What part of me posting about a scientific article that describes the consequences of the lack of sanitation on the health of the people of India did you not understand as showing that I have long been aware of the importance of sanitation? Diarrheal diseases are the second biggest killer after heart disease. But despite the lack of sanitation, vaccines eliminated polio. Sanitation and hygiene only go so far. In order to eliminate the threat of tetanus, we would have to sterilize the great outdoors.

          • tomonthebay

            Petey purports to be a naturopath. They tend to be anti-vaxxers. Vaccines aren’t natural. It is all about diet, hygiene, and that mysterious vital force ( with a dash of homeopathy and other woo thrown in for good measure.)

          • Peter Harris

            Says the man who doesn’t know the difference between RNA and DNA.

          • tomonthebay

            Where did that ridiculous assertion come from? Filed for any 50 year patents lately? Figured out yet that vaccines are intended to prevent disease and not used to cure them? Still trying to sell your lie about vitalism just being about diet? Still think there is any scientific validity to homeopathy? We know that a number of other posters in addition to Mohr and I have jumped in lately to highlight your ignorance. Good night sea lion.

          • Peter Harris

            The question I put your long time ago, and more recently, a question to you about your assertion that you know something of lamarckism and Epigenetics.

            And in the last few days, you have failed to address the facts regarding 150 years of improved sanitation and hygiene protocols, which has been agreed upon, within the British Journal of Medicine, greatly reduced diseases prior to the introduction of vaccines.

            Any comments on those three points?

            I guess not, knowing you, you’ll come back with some low IQ knuckle-dragging piece of nonsense.

          • Thomas Mohr

            Well, Petey, you don’t know either. You don’t even know that a C atom has only 4 bonds. The pathetic old android phone excuse, remember ?

          • Ron Roy

            Tommy speaks and says nothing of importance.

          • AutismDadd

            How lame. According to tom humans suffer from a shortage of pharmaceutical products.

          • schpadoinkle

            i did see a doctor’s letter online recently calling a child vaccine deprived 🙂

          • AutismDadd

            That’s one flucked up doctor.

          • schpadoinkle

            brainwashed minion.

          • Peter Harris

            Yep… true to form, and a predictable pattern by simpletons and flunkies such as yourself.

            You start out with silly and childish ad hominems and non sequiturs, and through the middle of your comment, you appeal to emotion.

            And once again, I’ll point out your reductionist Flim Flam…

            And to top it off, if it wasn’t already established, is your stupidity, and your final comment about sanitizing the Great Outdoors.

            And why are you so gormless and feckless, and you rely on all the cheap and silly arguments mentioned above??

            Is because once again, for the third time, you failed to mention what was the facts published in both the link you disregarded, and the link to the British Medical Journal.

            Once again, any comments on the facts provided in those two links?

            You are so pathological with your blinkered reductionist thinking, you cannot see other contributing factors that reduced diseases prior to the implementation of vaccines.

            That is your great problem, and untill you overcome that, you are just going to remain a gormless fool.

            But one thing is for sure, you’ll come back with the same nonsense, as mentioned above, and completely disregard the comments in the link of the British Medical Journal…

            And as a reminder…

            “In 2007, readers of the British Medical Journal voted that the introduction of clean water and sewerage—the ‘sanitation revolution’ of the Victorian era—was the most important medical milestone since the 1840s, over anaesthesia, antibiotics, or vaccines.”

            Note they added VACCINES.

          • Ron Roy

            Sanitation is important but diet is even more important. A person with a good diet can withstand the germs from unsanitary conditions.

          • AutismDadd

            Hilarious. Yet you expect us to vaccinate to some unattainable degree to protect a SMALL number of people who are immunocompromised or are babies rather that having safety plans to keep them safe.

          • Verna Lang

            Vaccinations are the safety nets to keep people safe. Yet you keep trying to take a machete to those nets. Your willingness to throw the lives of babies away needlessly is very telling of the depths of your obsession. From the WHO:
            “Each year, rotavirus causes approximately 111 million episodes of gastroenteritis requiring only home care, 25 million clinic visits, 2 million hospitalizations, and 352,000–592,000 deaths (median, 440,000 deaths) in children <5 years of age. By age 5, nearly every child will have an episode of rotavirus gastroenteritis, 1 in 5 will visit a clinic, 1 in 60 will be hospitalized, and approximately 1 in 293 will die. Children in the poorest countries account for 82% of rotavirus deaths. The tremendous incidence of rotavirus disease underscores the urgent need for interventions, such as vaccines, to prevent childhood deaths in developing nations.
            440,000 median deaths per year globally"
            .
            There is a reason why India is rolling out rotavirus vaccine as their next big campaign. They care about the deaths of their babies far more than you.

          • AutismDadd

            From the WHO, where Big Pharma rules. So a bunch of numbers. We can add 8,000,000 who die of starvation in our prosperous World each year. So will you demand some agency stop that?

          • Verna Lang

            No. I am more likely to be protesting the neo-colonial attitudes of agencies and governments that try to stop countries like Bangladesh and half of Africa from controlling their own science and the development of GMO crops that will help feed their populations. Can’t wait to cheer on the release of Golden Rice to farmers in Bangladesh in the near future. They have successfully tested the trait in their frequently cultivated rice varieties.
            What have you done to help feed the world other than trying to have kids die of vaccine preventable diseases before they have a chance to die from hunger?

          • Peter Harris

            “What have you done to help feed the world other than trying to have kids die of vaccine preventable diseases before they have a chance to die from hunger?

            Another masterful display a conflation.

          • AutismDadd

            And the starving children are starving because others control decisions? Sounds familiar. So WHERE is WHO the big shot WORLD agency while these people starve? Why are corporations like Bayer/Monsanto greasing palms like they do in Washington?

          • Verna Lang

            You know nothing, ADudd. What do corporations like Bayer have to do with Bangladeshi scientists creating GE crops so improved seeds can be handed out to Bangladeshi farmers at minimal cost? Most of the future development of new GE varieties will be coming from scientists in those developing countries who are creating solutions to local problems like brown streak virus in cassava. Or they will if the EU and NGOs like Greenpeace let them make their own decisions free of economic pressure and fear, uncertainty and doubt campaigns.
            As for WHO:

            WHO aims for a world free of all forms of malnutrition, where all people achieve health and wellbeing. According to the 2016–2025 nutrition strategy, WHO works with Member States and partners towards universal access to effective nutrition interventions and to healthy diets from sustainable and resilient food systems. WHO uses its convening power to help set, align and advocate for priorities and policies that move nutrition forward globally; develops evidence-informed guidance based on robust scientific and ethical frameworks; supports the adoption of guidance and implementation of effective nutrition actions; and monitors and evaluates policy and programme implementation and nutrition outcomes.

          • AutismDadd

            Bayer now owns Monsanto. I would expect them to NOT support others cutting into its profits. So WHO must be doing a bang up job with ONLY 8,000,000 starving each year.

          • tomonthebay

            Food distribution is not part of WHO’s mission.

          • AutismDadd

            yea just pharmaceutical distribution.

          • AutismDadd

            So World HEALTH Organization doesn’t realize food is damn good for health. Instead they believe a shortage of Harmaceuticals is.

          • sabelmouse

            i bet the back gmo !

          • AutismDadd

            Of course. WHO and Big Corporate/ Big Chemical are likely in collusion on many levels.

          • tomonthebay

            So trundle on down to their headquarters and tell them they need to expand their mission. Maybe give a speech about it to the U.N. General Assembly. Oh wait, they already address that with the World Food Programme (WFP) and the Food and Agricultural Organization (FAO).

          • AutismDadd

            And ONLY 8,000,000 starve to death each year. I’ll send them a thank-you card.

          • tomonthebay

            Yep and The WHO has nothing to do with that nor should it as it is not part of their mission. The U.N. has other organizations to deal with that. You are really a simpleton.

          • AutismDadd

            And as we see the “success rate” isn’t a success rate.

          • tomonthebay

            That still has absolutely no connection to WHO except in your tiny little mind.

          • schpadoinkle

            🙁

          • tomonthebay

            And pointing out that adadd, as usual doesn’t know what he is talking about makes you sad? Oh my.

          • totb said to moosey in her sockpuppet disguise, “… makes you sad? Oh my.”
            .
            “Cry me a river”, moosey.
            .
            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LbwjQSBH0sE

          • schpadoinkle

            i can’t but wonder what you’re hoping to achieve with this.

          • sabelmouse

            corporate monopoly as protest and saving children, yuop!

          • Verna Lang

            Funny. I never thought of government and academic scientists producing innovations to help local farmers in Bangladesh, Nigeria, Uganda, and many other developing countries as corporations. They don’t earn from sales of the seeds either. Must be a really bad business plan that they came up with.

          • sabelmouse

            please!!

          • Thomas Mohr

            Quote: “That’s funny, because the sociopathic, and misanthropic Mohr refers to Jpands quite often.”

            The next lie, Petey.

          • AutismDadd

            Verna likes to make things up as she waddles along.

          • Ron Roy

            I lived next to a small river called the Dead River. Why that name you ask? Well because half the sewage from homes ended up into that river. I remember kids actually sliding in that river where it was wide and only a few inches deep. And guess what they all lived to a ripe old age and the local health authorities never made a big deal about it. The point I’m trying to make is that even those with an average diet can withstand pollution from human waste. Ask anyone who fought in Vietnam and they will tell you the Vietnamese were fertilizing their rice paddies with human waste.

          • Proponent

            Ron Roy: “I lived next to a small river called the Dead River. Why that name you ask? Well because half the sewage from homes ended up into that river.”

            Don’t think so..

            “The Dead River starts from its head waters by the Canadian border north above Eustis, Maine. For a long stretch from by Rangeley, Maine it flows calm and smooth. This leads the river into what has been dammed up to create Flagstaff Lake. The shallow swampy stretch of river also flows slowly. The Native American’s had a term that meant, “flat, near motionless river”, and was translated into English as the DEAD RIVER!”

            (Source: “The Dead River: Where does its name come from?” )

            So.. you encourage parents to allow their children to play in, according to you, polluted waters? As long as their diet is sufficient (in your mind)?

            That’s.. weird, Ronald P. Roy.

            But, don’t let that stop you from creating and twisting things to suit your nonsensical rambling narrative.

            Next?

          • Ron Roy

            ”The Dead River is a 3.5-mile-long (5.6 km)[1] river located entirely
            within the city limits of Berlin, New Hampshire, in the United States.
            It is a tributary of the Androscoggin River, which flows south from
            Berlin before turning east at Gorham and into Maine, eventually joining
            the Kennebec River at Merrymeeting Bay” Source Wkipedia
            It never occurred to Proponent that there could have been many rivers by the same name. .Plus I never encouraged anyone to play in polluted waters I merely stated the fact that some people did. NEXT……………

          • Proponent

            Well, see now, Ronald P. Roy?

            It helps other readers to be clear about the things you are talking about when you post/comment.

            But, now that I know exactly which river you are referring to.. I can and did check out how the river came to be named as such.. and once again, point out your inaccuracy..

            “No one seems to know how the river came to be named the Dead River, or even when it acquired that name, although it dates back at least to the 1830s.”

            (Source: The Berlin Sun | “Bringing new life to the Dead River” )

            … …

            Next?

          • Ron Roy

            So no one seems to know. I know that why people of my generation called it that. I see you’re still avoiding the main point; That kids played in those polluted waters and lived to tell about it. Actually I did some research and it was once called the Plumpetussuck river. Next…..

          • AutismDadd

            No surprise the words defecation and diarrhea are in your comment. My sentiments exactly.

          • tomonthebay

            Of course that caught your attention considering your pre-adolescent obsession.

          • AutismDadd

            Take it up with Verna

          • tomonthebay

            Verna’s comment went directly to Peter’s claim. You are the one with the childish poo obsession.

          • AutismDadd

            Verna used those terms and I ridiculed her as usual.

          • tomonthebay

            Verna accurately described the situation in India you twit.

          • Peter Harris

            Hey you Twit, she did the very opposite, and completely avoided the general point altogether.

          • tomonthebay

            Your denial doesn’t make it so. Verna was spot on.

          • Peter Harris

            So confirmed, you have no evidence, now, or in the past for your ridiculous, stupid and infantile comments.

          • Acleron

            The rest of us can see your information free comments and lies and the responses to them.

          • Thomas Mohr

            Petey, the old game. Verbatim quote. However, I think your lack of reading comprehension cam through again. Like when you claimed that my sciencebasedmedcine said that Mao embraced TCM.

          • AutismDadd

            Your reading comprehension leaves MUCH to be desired.

          • Peter Harris

            Ha ha ha… sure.

            Your delusional state needs a quick remedy… maybe a vaccine?

          • AutismDadd

            You nailed it, as always.

          • Ron Roy

            Morbidity is not that important.Millions of people get colds every year and I don’t see the CDC telling news outlets that we should fear the common cold. However if in in a thousand did die from the common cold they would make a big issue out of it. Now remember I’m not talking about the flu with cold like symptoms. See the difference no mortality no big deal.

          • Thomas Mohr

            Let me explain something to you: To assess whether a disease vanishes, morbidity is what counts. Aside that, measles have complications and the rate is not small.

          • Ron Roy

            A little vitamin A would negate any serious side effects from measles and probably prevent measles itself. Ask the Helen Keller Foundation about that.

          • tomonthebay

            Good luck trying to explain anything to poor Ron. Hewent no further than high school (by his own admission) and it seems that either it wasn’t a very good high school or he barely (or didn’t) graduate.

          • Peter Harris

            As usual, the obsequious and sycophantic little puppy dog, follows Thomas around, hoping he will be thrown a few nibblies.

            What’s it like, playing the organ grinders monkey, to a sociopath and Nazi propagandist?

          • tomonthebay

            Poor petey. Desperate for his mackerel. Here you are. Honk, honk, clap, clap.

          • Peter Harris

            What’s wrong Tommy, Thomas hasn’t thrown you a bone yet today?

          • Thomas Mohr

            Nazi propagandist ? Verbatim quote, Petey.

            Let me lecture you you clown: comparing your ethics and your sometimes paranoid babbling to those of Nazis is hardly propaganda, Petey. Problems with reading comprehension surfacing again ?

          • Acleron

            What rubbish, if morbidity in colds were as severe as in measles, polio, mumps etc etc, all health authorities would be making a large issue out of it.

          • Ron Roy

            You’d better notify those health authorities then because when I did get colds they made me feel worst then when I had any of those childhood diseases.

          • Acleron

            You notify them Ron. I’m sure they’ll be interested in an unconfirmed and evidence free anecdote. /sarc

          • Mike Stevens

            Yup, open defecation is 40% in India, circa 2015.
            https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SH.STA.ODFC.ZS

            You could say “nearly half” and still be accurate.
            I guess in Peter’s book that means 4%.
            He never could math.

          • Thomas Mohr

            @mamadoctoo:disqus Quote: “Thomas Mohr is an outright sociopath, and a nefarious liar.”

            Well, Petey, explain this:

            https://disqus.com/home/discussion/naturopathicdiaries/naturopathic_medicine_has_too_much_quackery/#comment-4140823493

            Quote: “If you really are Thomas Mohr, it would be so easy to find your peers, and show them pictures of you with little boys and little girls. After all, you have clearly demonstrated, the powers of photo shopping.”

            And then we have this:

            Quote: “I wonder if N.N., N.N, N.N, N.N, N.N [names of colleagues redacted] would be interested in you trawling the Gürtels for little girls and boys.”

            available here: https://disqus.com/home/discussion/naturopathicdiaries/naturopathic_medicine_has_too_much_quackery/#comment-4140830359

            Contrary to you, Petey, I can quote you verbatim.

          • Thomas Mohr

            Petey, the real value that counts is morbidity and not mortality. How do you explain that measles morbidity dropped by a factor of at least 10 in the US within the first three years of the vaccine introduced ?

          • tomonthebay

            19 countries have the same litigation problems and chose to circumvent the risk of never-ending frivolous lawsuits interfering with the manufacture and distribution of vaccines because they are so important in preventing disease.

          • AutismDadd

            Groan. Nope

          • Peter Harris

            Can you name some of these frivolous lawsuits? I bet not..

          • jerry hamilton

            It certainly was in the case of Florence Nightingale.
            She never understood hygiene.

          • tomonthebay

            Middle ages pandemics burned themselves out after killing tens of thousands of victims.

          • AlexanderAmproz

            Cleanliness stop it in the early XX Century with viruses discovery,
            the Spanish flu killed 100 Millions in 1918…

          • tomonthebay

            Hygiene helped but vaccines have played a major role. It was a vaccine that eradicated smallpox, NOT improved hygiene and it is a vaccine that has us on the verge of eradicating polio.

          • jerry hamilton

            Really???
            On CHS we wrote previously about how unscientific the claim is that smallpox was eradicated by vaccination when that frankly is nonsense scientifically. The demise of the disease came about as a result of the interaction of three completely different factors: isolation, attenuation and improved living conditions, particularly nutrition and sanitation. The effect cannot be attributable to the smallpox vaccine – any vaccine which takes over 100 years to work ipso facto proves itself not to have:
            https://childhealthsafety.wordpress.com/2013/12/23/smallpox-eradication-one-of-historys-biggest-lies-how-vaccination-did-not-eradicate-smallpox/

          • tomonthebay

            CHS is NOT a credible source. The vaccine definitively is the reason that smallpox no longer infects anyone.

          • AutismDadd

            So correlation and supposition and exaggeration = causation?

          • Peter Harris

            Your modus operandi, is to just complain and whinge, but you provide no evidence or medical knowledge to back up your rantings.

          • Peter Harris

            As we approach the third decade of the 21st-century, I find it utterly absurd that the pharmaceutical/medical industrial complex, have the sheer arrogance and audacity to complain about alternative methods, when they themselves, have completely failed to cure cancer and disease generally.

          • jerry hamilton

            You do have a very financially valid point.

          • AlexanderAmproz

            Maybe you should tray Ayurveda?

            https://www.webmd.COM
            /balance/guide/ayurvedic-treatments#1

          • john tucci

            I will ask you again. What disease was cured by Naturopathy?

          • tomonthebay

            He claims he has personally cured diabetes, arthritis, and I don’t remember what all else for his marks. Of course if you believe that I have some oceanfront land in Arizona I would like to sell you.

          • Peter Harris

            Talking to one of the misanthropes many disqus accounts… good for you.

          • AlexanderAmproz

            TO PREVENT IS ALWAYS BETTER THAN TO CURE

            Not long ago, almost everybody was sleeping in the same room,
            and sewages were open air on the middle of the streets,
            London and Paris were particularly disgusting on that aspect.

            Rabies, Tetanus or Cholera are awfully terrible nightmare sickness,
            only vaccination will works…

            Today in HK there is disinfectant for hand wash by any lift
            in any building entrances, infrared camera at the Airport
            to detect flue.

            H1N1 was a frightening warning.

            If Spanish flue killed 100 Millions in 1918 out of a World 2 Billions
            population, how much today with 7 Billions, 350 Millions ? ? ?

            In some African places, the Culture is to kiss the dead,
            and Ebola spread alike a wild fire.

            The few years ago swine flue started in Mexico with awful pigsty
            concentration careless ness numbers in one place…

            WHO is watching carefully to avoid the next Spanish flue

            The Today travel industry moving Billions is worrisome
            for the next unavoidable World wide Pandemic…

            It will help to solve the Demographic Bomb on the way…

          • AutismDadd

            There are those who believe the Spanish Flu was caused by the vaccine used because of its effect on the military.

          • AlexanderAmproz

            The vaccines for flue were inexistant at that times,

            and different kind of flue is coming yearly
            with the birds migrations from Eurasia…

            Then vaccines for the Army in 1918, forget about…

          • AutismDadd

            Have ANY evidence, or is blah blah science?

          • tomonthebay

            Good grief Adumb, we know from decades and decades of data that smallpox vaccine eliminated smallpox. The hygiene song and dance is crap. If it was true then weaponizing smallpox wouldn’t work, yet we know that smallpox is a bioweapon threat.

          • AutismDadd

            I see no data in your response.

          • Acleron

            Duddy Boy probably thinks that weaponising smallpox means giving each virus a miniature bazooka.

          • tomonthebay

            Snort.

          • AutismDadd

            But WHO actually said that? Wasn’t me was it?

          • shay simmons

            Thank you for the iced tea that just went up my nose.

          • Peter Harris

            Any data to back up that emotional and absurd claim?

          • tomonthebay

            That vaccines eliminated smallpox and are on the verge of eliminating polio? Oh wait, a naturopath so of course you are a vaccine denier. Just one more part of naturopathies fantasy world.

          • Peter Harris

            Tommy boy, it is your claim, you need to back it up with some hard evidence, instead of just whinging like a petulant child.

          • tomonthebay

            PMID: 7044193

            Clinics in Dermatology
            Volume 24, Issue 3, May–June 2006, Pages 152-157
            The history of smallpox
            Alasdair M.GeddesMD, FRCP
            Includes a nice discussion of the potential use of smallpox as a bioweapon. Guess what is a major component of the defense for that petey. Why, it is a vaccine!!!!!! Imagine that. Only cranks and fools (e.g. naturopaths) deny that vaccines prevent diseases and were key to eliminating smallpox and that vaccination is on the verge of eliminating polio. We know vaccines work from decades and decades and decades of experience. That is why I got my Shingrix vaccination this year and get my annual flu jab. Also got my TDaP this year.

          • Peter Harris

            You can post as many explanation marks as you like, but your emotion is not working, and certainly does not make your argument work.

            Again, I’ll just drag you back to the point, where is the evidence that any vaccine has cured anybody, without the overwhelming and dramatic help of changes in the environment?

          • tomonthebay

            And there is your complete ignorance on full display again Petey. What the hell do they teach you in naturopathy school? Vaccines don’t cure anybody. They prevent the vaccinated from getting the disease and the field study for the 1st polio vaccine is a classic and proved conclusively that the vaccine prevented polio.

          • Peter Harris

            Of course, true to form, you deflect away from the question, with some idiotic statement and ad hominem.

            Again Tommy, present an argument, that shows that vaccines cured all those diseases alone, without any help from environmental factors, over the last say 70 or 80 decades?

            But true to form, you’ll come back with some gormless and feckless comment, which only shows you are indeed a simpleton, and you know nothing about medicine and biology.

          • tomonthebay

            Only someone with zero understanding of immunology thinks vaccines cure. They prevent disease and that has been firmly established except in the minds of those who engage in magical thinking like vitalism and the magic water of homeopathy.

          • Peter Harris

            Again, just reinforcing my previous point, that you are a simpleton, and know nothing about medicine and biology.
            My word, you do shoot yourself in the foot, and in many cases, such as now, shoot yourself in the head.

          • tomonthebay

            You keep proving my point that you know nothing every time you ask about vaccines curing diseases. If you don’t understand how vaccines work it is obvious that your knowledge base is totally deficient.

          • Peter Harris

            Hahaha, nice try Tommy, but it’s you who has the credibility problem.

            Again, provide some evidence that vaccines alone eliminated diseases, without the help of environmental changes.

          • tomonthebay

            Gee Petey, if hygiene eliminated smallpox then why does the military need to keep a vaccine on hand to deal with the possibility of its use as a bioweapon? And why did you keep asking about vaccines curing disease? You apparently don’t know how vaccines work and the difference between prevention and cure. Vaccine efficacy denial is one of the most obvious proofs of the intellectual bankruptcy of naturopathy rivalling the belief in the magic water of homeopathic products.

          • Peter Harris

            Gee Tommy…

            You cannot answer a simple question?
            After you get red in the face, claiming your pharmaceutical/medical credentials?

            No, but instead you create a smoke screen, which is to hide your ignorance and stupidity, by asking me questions that you cannot answer yourself.

            And one other thing, it just highlights your black and white view of the world, which includes medicine and biology and disease processes.

            Keep up Tommy, you are the comic relief on these threads.

          • tomonthebay

            Already provided you with a couple of reference Petey. Can’t you read?

          • Peter Harris

            Don’t you get tired of running around in circles?

            Don’t you get tired or embarrassed with the way you make yourself look stupid?

            Again, even if you have provided a “couple” of references, you need to provide many more…

            And more importantly, make your argument in relation to the citations / data that you produce.

          • tomonthebay

            What is it with you and your demands? You are making the claim that flies in the face of documented, accepted medical science. Let’s see your proof that vaccination didn’t end smallpox. I can hardly wait.

          • Peter Harris

            “What is it with you and your demands?”

            😄😅😂😁😂😅😂

            Another diversionary tactic from you, it’s just comical.

            I’m not demanding at all, just merely asking you to… One, make your argument as to why you have this simplistic black and white view of vaccines, and their alleged effects, and at the same time (secondly) for you to backup your knowledge on the history of medicine and biology.

          • tomonthebay

            No, you are sealioning. We know vaccines work. We have studies like the original field study for the polio vaccine (Francis T, Jr, Korns R, Voight R, Boisen M, Hemphill F, Napier J, et al. An evaluation of the 1954 poliomyelitis vaccine trials: summary report. Am J Public Health. 1955;45(suppl):1–50). that prove definitively the effectiveness of those vaccines. We have animal studies were animals are vaccinated and directly challenged with the organism that prove the concept. We have decades of immunological research. We have success stories in animals as well as people (rinderpest). So you are the one that has to provide some good, verifiable studies debunking vaccine effectiveness. Good luck with that.

          • Peter Harris

            Yes, when you failed and painted yourself in the corner, you come out screaming about sea lions.

            All that useless dribble, and nothing about environmental changes over a period of time.

          • tomonthebay

            More lies. Handed you one of the most definitive studies ever done. You are completely full of sh*t.

          • Peter Harris

            Tommy boy, you mentioned mackerel earlier, well you have the memory of a goldfish.

            I said to you, provide some clear-cut evidence that there was no environmental changes involved, in helping prevent the spread of diseases, over the decades that vaccines were implemented.

            In other words, I’ll put it another way for a simpleton like you, provide some evidence that vaccines alone prevented all those diseases, without any other changes in the environment, even changes within the medical profession itself, when it comes to disease treatments, and the possible contribution to reducing those diseases.

            Maybe long questions are too difficult for you to read and understand.

          • tomonthebay

            Better hygiene helps but the vaccines are the reason for the disappearance of smallpox and the impending disappearance of polio. Vaccines are the reasons that measles, mumps, and rubella outbreaks are news in the western world. Thanks to vaccination those diseases may well go the way of smallpox and polio. Environmental changes would never have eliminated smallpox or polio and won’t eliminate those other diseases either unless the environmental change is the disappearance of the human race.

          • Peter Harris

            I posted my reply to you, on another thread, because every time I post here, it gets flagged as spam.

          • Peter Harris

            Once again, the opinion of a simpleton, who admits, through omission, he has no understanding of medicine and biology, let alone the history of diseases.

            Provide some statistical analysis, and least make an effort and provide some links to backup your argument.

          • Thomas Mohr

            Petey, explain why the measles morbidity dropped between 1965 and 1970 from ~ 2000 per 100.000 to below 100 per 100.000. What exactly was the sanitary development leading to this, Petey ? Within 5 years ?

            Let me lecture you, Petey. Looking at the mortality of a disease tells only half the story. The morbidity is what counts, Petey.

          • Thomas Mohr

            Petey, you can not even distinguish between cure and prevention. You have proven that over and over, Petey. A naturopath not knowing this difference. The ultimate incompetence, Petey.

          • Peter Harris

            Still waiting for you to substantiate your crazy claim of being a peer-review scientist with 25 years experience.

          • tomonthebay

            More demands from the sea lion. Where’s my mackerel. Shove it petey. You are a proven liar and a charlatan. Let’s see your proof. (Not holding my breath).

          • Peter Harris

            I’ll translate your cowardice and dribble… I, Tommy the twat, can’t answer a simple question.

            So I play the victim, and carry on like a petulant child.

          • Mike Stevens

            There is a naturopathy school? …pull the other one!
            Don’t you just decide one day to call yourself a “naturopath”, and get on with bilking money for the vulnerable public by giving them exorbitantly overpriced plant extracts you dream up? That’s what Harris does, anyhow.

          • Deadpool

            Mike, bilking people is a skill that has to be learned and practiced. Of course there’s a school.

          • Peter Harris

            Oh, what other diseases have vaccines cured, without any environmental help?

          • Acleron

            Mostly, vaccines prevent disease, not cure them. Harris hasn’t yet learned this simple point.

          • AlexanderAmproz

            One 50 Years ago apple is equivalent of 20 todays wrongly selected !

          • Peter Harris

            😂😅😂🤣😂😅😂😅🤣😂

          • schpadoinkle

            how exceedingly ignorant.

          • tomonthebay

            Is that so? How are they related schpad?

          • tomonthebay

            It isn’t their job.

          • AutismDadd

            Oh so it HAS to be their JOB in order to acknowledge wrongdoing.

          • Acleron

            The only people dim enough to fall for your childish tactics are those as dim as you, ie antivaxxers. Back in reality, you have no evidence for your claims.

          • tomonthebay

            Starvation is a problem of food distribution, not medical science. You constantly make incorrect claims about false equivalence and then make a case of clear false equivalence. You are truly clueless.

          • AutismDadd

            Where in my post do I compare starvation to vaccines?

          • tomonthebay

            You are assailing medical science and vaccines are your personal obsession.

          • AutismDadd

            In other words its not there, so you deflect.

          • tomonthebay

            It is always about vaccines with you dud.

          • AlexanderAmproz

            Healthy divers organic food is the Keys to almost everything !

          • AlexanderAmproz

            In South-East Asia 40 Years ago,
            “High-Blood”, Diabetes, Cancer and overweight were almost inexistent,
            Thanks of the Western Junk-Food it’s booming today !

            Filipinos 30% didn’t eat every days,
            but Mindanao well managed can feed 300 Millions !

            United Fruit Company and Del Monte are a Major Poisonous
            “Silent” problem in the Philippines

            Children’s death before 5 years old in RP is the same
            than the Sahel Desert, Africa worst !

          • AutismDadd

            No doubt the area has become polluted as big Capital/ big corporate move in. All thing laid in waste when certain types show up.

          • AutismDadd

            Ignore Acleron. Who or whatever he is, there is no need to win over his cold heart and closed mind.

          • jerry hamilton

            That is so true.
            A real shame people like that exist.

          • Acleron

            Please carry on chatting with Duddy Boy, you are suited for each other.

          • jerry hamilton

            Olivia Newton John recovered from cancer recently.
            I am so sorry for you.
            It is obvious you would rather she was dead.
            Just please…. Shut up.

          • Acleron

            You have no idea what I like, I certainly have no wish that anybody die of any disease, you remark is just the vileness expected from charlatans who make claims but have no evidence.

          • jerry hamilton

            Please. Pretty please, just take all your love for big pharma and shove it where the sun don’t shine.
            I have had it with government siko’s.
            Please. Don’t reply you slck fck.

          • Mike Stevens

            I dare you to contact ONJ and tell her to stick her Proton Beam therapy where the sun don’t shine.

          • Acleron

            So you don’t want a reply, I’m hardly surprised, tough luck. You also have no idea what I think about the pharmaceutical industry.

            So you are, from your comments, just another silly idiot. Please do reply, you will only confirm what I said.

          • AlexanderAmproz

            Welcome back !

          • jerry hamilton

            Hiya Alexander, not so much a welcome back as an, oops, I got terminal cancer.
            I am trying any possibilities while the rest of the forum are happy encouraging me to die.
            They are excellent at kicking crutches.
            They even ignore lots of evidence to do it.
            I have never come across such a load of sick people in one place.
            Hope you are doing alright.

          • AlexanderAmproz

            Once upon the time, a Greek in the US had a terminal cancer
            and went back to die in his childhood village on an Island mountain,
            meeting his old friends and life style.
            He planted vegetables in his garden,
            while he knows he will not harvest them.
            His return to a Normal Life and Food cured him totally.

            The only advise I can give you is to live with seasonal organic
            fruits and vegetables.
            I am enjoying daily delicious Muscat grapes, skin and seeds have
            to be chewed.
            It’s known to prevent sickness since the Antiquity
            Aside that delicious Chanterelles from Eastern Europe are available
            on the Market for reasonable prices, or walk in the forest
            to look for it, but beware of mushrooms you didn’t know
            or can’t identify clearly …

            Healthy food and exercises your body is done to cure all,
            but if you have a Car accident, don’t go to the herbalist !

            I didn’t trust much the medicines too,
            but if it’s bacterias, antibiotic is needed

            Ithaca/Greece is among the best place and food for a
            long life with a good health.
            I do remember my childhood vacation in Tinos at the time they
            didn’t had roads but Donkeys.
            A farmer was coming daily with a cow
            for the milk…
            https://en.wikipedia.ORG/wiki/Ithaca
            If you can, spend the Winter under the Sun…

          • jerry hamilton

            Winter under the Sun. I want it.

            I saw my oncologist today who gave me the all clear to do the various proven protocols I have been researching.
            She quietly mentioned that there has been a large success rate with Apricot Kernels and the Budwig protocol.
            Officially, she is not allowed to know anything about it.
            She does know it can be beat.
            Isn’t it sick that all the people here that decide it won’t work know nothing at all about it.

          • tomonthebay

            No reputable oncologist would endorse apricot kernels or Budwig.

          • rat doctor

            Apricot kernels? He can’t be serious.

          • Acleron

            Yes, that was what he claimed but as he cannot distinguish an oncologist from a biochemist, he could have got that from his local witch doctor.

          • Mike Stevens

            Olivia Newton John has not “recovered from cancer recently”.
            She has had a second recurrence of metastatic cancer, having had conventional medical therapy previously times (which included mastectomy and radiotherapy).

            Currently (2018) she has spinal metastases.
            She has undergone Photon Beam therapy, a conventional therapy that uses gamma radiation produced by a linear accelerator.
            Of course, she has also used some complementary therapies, although these will not help in any way other than as supportive psychological therapy.
            She is doing well.
            Thank heavens for medicine and science!

          • JoeFarmer

            Read Jerry’s other posts – he’s a certifiable nutcase.

          • jerry hamilton

            All the evidence you could ever want is provided in the book
            WORLD WITHOUT CANCER by G. Edward Griffin.
            You however won’t read it because it does not support your sick argument.
            It contains ALL the proof going back to Standard Oil with Rockefeller supporting Hitler in 1933.
            You can’t worm your way out of this one, there is far too much evidence.
            Except you will still deny it all.

          • Acleron

            Evidence is in the form of peer reviewed properly published results of comparisons between treatments. You have consistently refused to provide any, the conclusion is that you do not have any.

          • jerry hamilton

            There is no evidence you would ever accept.
            Please, just sod off.

          • Acleron

            How would you know when you cannot supply any to look at?

            BTW, I’m not going anywhere. I always find it amusing that anybody who exposes your lack of evidence for your claims is asked to go away while a lot of your ilk are screaming that they are censored.

          • JoeFarmer

            “There is no evidence you would ever accept.”

            Translation: I don’t have anything that remotely resembles evidence.

            “Please, just sod off.”

            Translation: “I’m an entitled nutcase, so you should let me pollute the internet with any kind of complete nonsense I can invent, unchallenged.”

          • jerry hamilton

            You are right. Now be a good little boy and pollute somewhere else.

          • JoeFarmer

            No one will ever accuse you of being smart, Jerry.

          • jerry hamilton

            I can take a horse to water but I can’t make it drink.

          • Acleron

            When you don’t supply any water the horse can never drink.

          • jerry hamilton

            If the horse is demented and does not smell or see water, that is very true. Demented?

          • Acleron

            Lol, so I’m demented for asking for evidence and you aren’t for not supplying it. Thank Zeus that in rational society it is universally accepted that the person making the claim has a duty to supply the evidence supporting it. Otherwise it is assumed they are talking out of their hat.

          • jerry hamilton

            Yes. You are demented for asking for it.
            I have given you loads yet you are not intelligent enough to look at any of it.
            You are a waste of time now pretty please Go Away.
            You have nothing that I want.

          • AutismDadd

            tomonthebay and acleron are pro-vac trolls and they go around like a gang attacking individual belief.

          • jerry hamilton

            No. They are not trying to attack an individual belief.
            They are trying to piss off the sane people here on this forum as their sick form of fun.
            Never have I come across such sick individuals.
            I have finished with them

          • Acleron

            No, we are attacking uneducated, nonsensical claims like yours

          • AutismDadd

            That’s what I said…face palm except for the uneducated, nonsensical part.

          • Acleron

            Yes, hit yourself in the head more often, it might drive some sense into it.

          • AutismDadd

            Is that what you tried? Obviously it doesn’t work.

          • john tucci

            When the head is a vacuum, no banging will help.

          • AutismDadd

            But you certainly empty your bowels.

          • Acleron

            Duddy Boy talking randomly about the only topic he appears to have any knowledge of.

          • tomonthebay

            He certainly has an unhealthy fixation on excrement. More evidence of his arrested development and emotional immaturity.

          • AutismDadd

            I can detect those full of s hit a mile away. They walk funny and sit down a lot.

          • Acleron

            https://youtu.be/sLRsuTcBv3Y will illuminate your fetish.

          • AutismDadd

            SPAM

          • tomonthebay

            Poor dud. Doesn’t like having his fetish pointed out to the world.

          • AutismDadd

            Sure tom the WORLD reads Disqus.

          • tomonthebay

            If nobody reads them why do you bother commenting?

          • AutismDadd

            Reading comprehension issues again. Where did I say NOBODY? You said the WORLD

          • tomonthebay

            LOL!!!!!!!

          • Acleron

            How can I deny it when you haven’t supplied anything?

          • jerry hamilton

            Hmmm. No-one of intellect posted.
            Nothing to reply to.

          • Acleron

            It was interesting that the moment you were asked for evidence you immediately resorted to insult. Don’t worry, you are just a an irrationalist.

          • jerry hamilton

            And you are incredibly ignorant to ignore the evidence I have given.
            Still no intelligent comments to answer I might as well sleep now.

          • Acleron

            And the next stage of an antivaxxer, lying. You have provided me no evidence whatsoever.

          • Acleron said, “And the next stage of an antivaxxer, lying.”
            .
            K00ks lie. Constantly. It’s part of the job description.

          • jerry hamilton

            You are not worth bothering with little boy.
            Goodbye.

          • Acleron

            Can’t say you haven’t been useful in advertising that antivaxxers have no evidence and fail to honestly debate.

          • jerry hamilton

            Listen Tweedle Dum. You can’t say a thing.
            Except you always do anyway.
            I have never ever mentioned anything to do with vaccines or anti vaccines. Ever.
            It all lives in your sick little imagination.
            Now please be a good little boy and go away.
            Far away.

          • Acleron

            Sorry, you are a nonsense alternative nonsense pedlar with no evidence and the usual pathetic insults and lies. While charlatans like you are trying to mislead people into ignoring proper medical advice, I won’t be going anywhere.

          • jerry hamilton

            I don’t expect you to go anywhere.
            Lying rancid trolls who like to stir trouble, enjoy the annoyance they cause, too much.
            Enjoy your sickness.

          • Acleron

            You are a lying antimedder who with little education thinks that a book constitutes evidence. You have the arrogance to also think that you have an unfettered right to spread your misinformation. Until you start to honestly debate with evidence you will be treated as a fool.

          • jerry hamilton

            To be treated by a fool by an incredibly ignorant fool is quite something.
            Be a good little boy now and go away.

          • Acleron

            You still haven’t got it yet, while you spread your nonsense and endanger all, I’m staying right here pointing out you have no evidence for your nonsense and a pronounced inability to debate any point.

            BTW, worked out who Griffin is yet? He’s the guy you cited, idiot.

          • AutismDadd

            Tell Acleron to go back to the children’s table.

          • jerry hamilton

            Hear that Aleron. Play times over. Back to class.

          • tomonthebay

            It would appear that you never went to class. It is obvious you don’t have any scientific education.

          • tomonthebay

            Like anyone with a brain pays any attention to Adudd.

          • Mike Stevens

            Strange how you keep responding to him then, isn’t it?

          • jerry hamilton

            You are quite right.
            He is like an annoying fly you want to swat.
            Responding has finished.

          • tomonthebay

            Citing Griffin’s nonsense is only proof of your lack of understanding of actual science.

          • jerry hamilton

            “Citing Griffin’s nonsense”…….. Who the fck is Griffin and what does he have to do with me?????
            Nothing worse than sick lying trolls who invent non existent scenarios.
            But you always will.

          • tomonthebay

            From your own comment, direct quote “All the evidence you could ever want is provided in the book
            WORLD WITHOUT CANCER by G. Edward Griffin”
            Griffin is a crank and obviously so are you.

          • jerry hamilton

            You are quite right.
            Lucky the world has you to point out who the cranks are.
            Or could you be the crank?
            You seem to hate intellect. Most cranks do.

          • tomonthebay

            Hate intellect? LOL. You just haven’t cited anyone that has an demonstrable level of intellectual achievement, unless you consider running cons like the likes of Griffin intellectual. It seems to be quite obvious from your posts that your “scientific education” comes primarily from Dr. Google and reading unscientific crap like Griffin’s.

          • Peter Harris

            You’ve got Tommy Boy nailed. Succinctly put.

          • Acleron

            Good grief, he doesn’t remember the stupidity he posted. What is it with this subset that never reads back through their comments? Bots?

          • tomonthebay

            Too dumb to be a bot.

          • tomonthebay

            Griffin is an AIDS/HIV denier and has zero scientific credibility. You are incredibly gullible.

          • john tucci

            A friend of mine has so far survived 13 years from Cancer, thanks to Chemo.

        • Ron Roy

          714X Brain cancer cure rate 50% Dr Burzynski’s antineoplaston cancer cure rates 40 t0 60%. Royal Raymond Rife cancer cure rates 100%.

          • Acleron

            Do you know what those things have in common?

            None have any evidence.

          • jerry hamilton

            Yes. Bob Beck has had an amazing success too in the field of electronics and the human body.

          • Ron Roy

            I had never heard of Bob Beck. Thanks for the information. I just looked him up. Another sure way of defeating cancer that the MEDICAL MAFIA suppresses.

          • jerry hamilton

            Yes, his methods were used by one of the greatest oncologists we have ever had. Johanna Budwig.
            She is one you must know. Brilliant woman.

          • tomonthebay

            You sure idolize a lot of quacks.

          • Acleron

            Budwig was a biochemist.

          • tomonthebay

            Pure BS ronny.

    • Ron Roy

      ”Trade in human misery.” Mmmmm Oh you mean like doctor and oncologist Farid Fata who treated at least 550 people for cancers they didn’t have or over treated them when they did?

      • Acleron

        If only the quacks like you were similarly treated, society would be far better.

    • AutismDadd

      What a meaningless rant.

  • Unfortunately, Parliament’s ‘Minister for Quackery’, David Tredinnick MP, is taken in – and wants the government to be:

    http://www.theyworkforyou.com/wrans/?id=2016-05-18.37034.h&s=speaker%3A10602#g37034.q0

    • chiz

      IT IS AMUSING TO READ YOUR DOOR BANGING AGAIN . ONLY IF CANCER KNOCK ON YOUR DOOR
      MAYBE YOU START LOOKING FOR WAYS TO SAVE YOUR PETTY LIFE. INSTED OF PROMOTING NOT WHAT WORKING BUT WHAT NOT [ACCORDING TO YOUR BELIF] . IF ONE US TO DIE IN THE PROPER WARD IT IS OK WITH U . I SW HOW DOCTORS JOKED AT ME TELLING THEM THAT DR SIMONSINI
      USE BAKING POWDER FOR CANCER .2 YEARS LATER NON OF THEM INVESTED THE 5 MINUTS OF LOOKINF INTO IT . TIME AND AHAIN WE READ OF THIS RICH AND FAMOSE PASSING WITH THE BEST MEDICALLS , SIMPLY BECAUSE THEY HAD THE MONEY OR POWER TO GET THE BEST DOCTORS.
      DO U THINK DOCTORS LIVE LONGER ? IF U DO THER IS NO WAY OF HELPING U . IF NOT ,AND THIS IS THE CASE WHY U RELAY ONLY ON THEM ?
      THE INTERNET IS FULL OF FOOLS ,OK .BUT ,IF SOMEONE TELL YOU A STORY HE ISNT GOING TO MAKE MONEY FROM , WHY DON’T U GIVE IT A CHANCE ,MAYBE EVEN READ ? TRY ” DANDILLION CANCER” ENTER…

      • Glad your amused (again?). What know you of my ‘PETTY LIFE’ ? You need to clarify your point (if you have one). Lest you be deemed to be just another fool promoting nonsense cancer ‘cures’ on the internet.

        • What is the difference between “nonsense cancer cures on the internet” and “drugs prescribed by a doctor”?

          The “nonsense cancer cures on the internet” might CURE your cancer.

          The drugs the doctor prescribes CANNOT.

          • Karin

            The difference is that medical doctors have evidence of their ability to cure people of cancer. Nonsense internet cures don’t.

          • Not a chance. IN FACT, Doctors CANNOT CLAIM to CURE anything. They are Practicing. When you put your big-girl pants on. ..go educate yourself on Hippcrates “Unani” System of Medicine. IF you are TOO IGNORANT, INCAPACITATED AND INADEQUATE to HELP YOURSELF, BY ALL MEANS, SETTLE for Medicinal & Surgical Care (BUMS – Bachelor of Unani Medicine & Surgery), HOWEVER, I am under NO OBLIGATION TO PARTICIPATE IN YOUR STUPIDITY. This is why: Voting AND Taxation are VOLUNTARY and those of us who can Police & Govern ourselves are “Free To Move About The Cabin”. Declaration of Independence ENUMERATES ALL THE RIGHTS we require: Life, Liberty, and Pursuit of Happiness ENDOWED BY THEIR CREATOR. IF you have a conduit MORE DIRECT than MINE to the CREATOR please SUMMON HIM and I’ll have a read. IF instead you’re JUST going to bait in on the MARIJUANA FRAUD. Well that is your choice. Enjoy.

          • Karin

            What’s with all the capitalization? I can’t read that. Try proper grammar and adult language if you want to be taken seriously.

          • Acknowledgement is the Path to Admission. Admission is the Accepted Price of Entry. Acceptance is the Path to Understanding. Ignorance is the Path to Knowledge. Over Stand. Stand Over.

          • Karin

            You’re still making no sense. Oh well.

          • tw0468
          • Gold

            Heh… This takes me back to reading the Principia Discordia. That was an awesome book mainly because it was full of the sort of nonsense that HempShare wrote above.

            Hail Eris! Kallisti!! All hail Discordia!!!

            )|(

          • Karin

            Sounds interesting. It does seem, sometimes, that all these science deniers are arguing from the same book.

          • AutismDadd

            Explain how we are science deniers.

          • Karin

            You are denying clear scientific consensus about the effectiveness of vaccines and chemotherapy.

          • Karin

            I am not trying to be rude or anything, but I’m done with this discussion. It has been going on for too long

          • Mike Stevens

            Yeah, it helps to ignore the most vexatious trolls like Adad and Harris.

          • AutismDadd

            We are suggesting there are flaws all around and medical consensus only means best practice. Vaccines, being undeniably unsafe are still used because no better option exists.

          • tw0468
          • tw0468
          • TagMan

            Now come on HempShare – how are our good doctors going to get rich by “curing people? No – they don’t talk about “cures” anymore – it’s all about “managing your illness.” As long as they can keep you sick with having you die – they will be making money out of you. Be fair!!

          • tw0468
          • tw0468
          • Nonsense. Western Doctors are not only “practicing”, but they are BUMS. Bachelor of Unani Medicine and Surgery. Medicine & Surgery are the LAST TWO RESORTS of CARE designed by Hippocrates. Spirituality & Nutrition are the FIRST-LINE of Care. Retail of Business of Food and Retail Business of Medicine go hand in hand creating the Consumptive Waste for Bacteria and Bacteria-Hosting Virus. Doctors do not know Cancer is Bacterial because they ARE NOT EDUCATED about the Cannabis-Activated Retrograde Synaptic Signaling System in the Human Body. Without Cannabis Humans are LOW-VIBRATIONAL HOSTS for Bacteria. A Prison per se. Stupidity is in the Mind of those Brain-Washed to believe in “Medical Doctor’s” Authority over YOUR SYMPTOMS. Complete and Utter Stupidity. In the past, Imbeciles were Euthanized after three (3) generations. Combined with the release of mental patients into society, AND treating these patients with DRUGS on the STREETS instead of in PROFESSIONAL CARE INSTITUTIONS evidences THESE VERY DOCTOR’S OWN STUPIDITY to match that of their patients. Hence, the comments we see about PROVEN CURES LIKE CANNABIS, 5,000 years before the Internet. BOZO.

          • tw0468
          • TagMan

            Aahhh NOPE. Absolutely WRONG Karin.

          • Karin

            Is that your whole argument? “Aahhh NOPE”?

          • tw0468
          • TagMan

            What else do you need Karin? The medical FACT that the 5 year survival rate for cancer on chemotherapy is 2.1%? The FACT that the Einstein College of Medicine now ADMITS that chemo SPREADS cancer;Tte indisputable PROOF that frequency can cure cancer (see Royal Raymond Rife who actually shows cancer cells under the first microscope powerful enough to see a living cell (and BUILT by Rife) being destroyed by frequency), the front page news articles between the 1930s and 1950 of the top medical professionals in the US lining up to get their photographs taken with him and giving him accolades for the number of people he was curing of cancer, the New Zealand farmer whose family forced the hospital to give high dose vitamin C intravenously when he was about to be taken off life support and who is now back on the farm… What else were you wanting? I didn’t list this information before because people with your view rarely will believe that anything but a pill will work, and I’m not into wasting my time…

          • Karin

            Your claim about chemo spreading cancer shows a misunderstanding of the research

            https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/does-chemotherapy-cause-cancer-to-spread/

          • disqus_1yb8x39w7X

            Wrong again.

          • Karin

            You’ve shared ZERO credible evidence to back your claims. The Rife claims are unsubstantiated — there’s never been anyone who was able to successfully replicate his claims. Surely you have more than that? Some guy claiming he got better isn’t proof that anything is an effective cure. That’s not how science works.

          • TagMan

            Karin – I AM a scientist and I guess you are NOT. For you – ANYTHING that comes out of a “laboratory” – however questionable, – is “real” – ESPECIALLY if the actor is wearing a white coat and carrying a stethoscope har har. I LOVE it! I have doctors in several countries buying Rife machines from me and finding that cancer that was not responding to your beloved chemo, is being removed by the machines. You start to realise how stupid people are when they can accept that electronic signals can carry voice AND pictures all over the world and beyond, it can take pictures of what is inside your body (AND under the ground even), it can BURN, it can cook food, it can blow something as hard as KIDNEY stones into fragments that the kidneys can pass but there’s NO WAY it could possibly do that to a cancer cell eh Karin. Cos they are SPECIAL – they somehow don’t conform to science as we know it har har. If you had any IDEA of the stuff we did in electronic warfare your tiny mind probably wouldn’t cope.

            How many clinical studies did it take to agree that bullets in the brain would kill Karin. Damn you HAVE to believe in evolution because people are becoming dumber by the day!

          • Karin

            Your reluctance to share any published independent peer reviewed studies to back your claim makes me doubt very much that you are any kind of credible scientist.

            Of course, the fact that you use the word “believe” to describe your opinion about evolution, as well as to say that people getting dumber (as you scientifically put it) is evidence of evolution, again tells me a lot about your credibility as any kind of scientist. I think not.

          • TagMan

            See – once again – don’t answer the question – just go straight to COMPLETELY unqualified abuse. Damn i hope you aren’t married karin because i can’t IMAGINE the hell a husband would go through living with you!

            Oh – and in case you didn’t notice – I haven’t EVER said that chemo DOESN’T work – only that it RARELY works, and in the process can even SPREAD cancer. Just the number of people who have supposedly been “cured’ by chemo and then had the cancer come back – often somewhere else in the body, should be evidence enough of it’s need to be questioned.

          • Karin

            Lol. You could not be more wrong. On every single front.

          • TagMan

            Oh REALLY then how come virtually EVERY SINGLE PERSON I have helped has been AFTER chemo and the cancer coming back?

          • tomonthebay

            Chemo does not spread cancer. Your level of ignorance is amazing.

          • Peter Harris

            It doesn’t cure it either.

          • tomonthebay

            You asked for a lie you have told. This is a big one. Goodbye Peter. Since you are so clearly dishonest and a stalker I am going to block you. Buh bye!

          • Peter Harris

            Well, show me the data that proves that chemo alone cures cancer.

          • Karin

            Why does it have to be chemo alone? Adjuvant therapy is more effective. I’ve posted 5 different examples throughout this thread to prove the effectiveness of various types of chemo for various types off cancer.

          • Peter Harris

            Because many doctors, like Tom Thumb, believe chemo alone can “treat” cancer.

            However, the question should be about a complete and permanent cure.

          • Karin

            Show me evidence out anything that’s more effective than chemo.

          • Peter Harris

            Exactly!
            And that’s part of the question I put to you.
            The medical profession have been too lazy, blinkered and willfully ignorant, to contemplate any other methods of treatment.

            But if you read my question again, you’ll see I’m looking beyond treatment.
            We should be talking about cure.

          • Karin

            So you think that modern medicine doesn’t talk about cures for cancers? I have personally met research oncologists who’ve dedicated their lives to that. There are multiple cures that are already used. It’s just an extremely complex set of diseases.

          • Peter Harris

            Dedication, does not equal results.
            Recent history is a guide.

            There are multiple cures? Where?

            Oh, I hear that all the time, it’s “extremely complex.”
            It’s not really.
            However, the Pharmaceutical/Medical industrial complex wants everyone to believe that, because it keeps the endless research dollars coming in, and provides many research jobs, which will ultimately provide nothing in the way of a cure.

          • Karin

            Throughout this thread I have shared examples of highly effective Cancer Treatments, many which have cured a large proportion of patients. Do you want me to paste them all in this box? Or are you able to scroll through the threads to find them?

          • jerry hamilton

            Just post the ones that sustained life for 6 months or more.
            Small box huh.

          • joe

            I have already told him that my Cancer team hold a think tank once a month to discuss treatment of Brain Cancer, I even NAMED the doctors involved and what did I get from PETER—-ZILCH– because he has NOTHING. —-caps for emphasis.

          • tomonthebay

            Peter is a fraud.

          • joe

            Yeah big time.

          • Peter Harris

            Says Tom Thumb, who doesn’t have the courage to debate with me.

          • TagMan

            Karen I don’t know of anything that is more effective than chemo at removing hair, destroying the gut, making people sicker than a pig etc etc etc but more effective than chemo in dealing with CANCER?? There’s not enough ROOM here girl!

          • jerry hamilton

            Are you trying to say the likes of you would accept evidence you have already decided not to?

          • Karin

            Doctors do not believe things. They make decisions based in scientific evidence. Your language belies you. And no doctors claimed that chemo alone treat cancer necessarily. Please share your evidence. I have shared multiple examples of completing permanent cures that are evidence-based. You just choose to dismiss them because you don’t understand them

          • AutismDadd

            You had me at “Doctors don’t believe things”

          • jerry hamilton

            No. They make decisions based on income.

          • joe

            I am living proof that Chemo cures Cancer, had Chemo in 2011, saw the specialist last April (2017) and he told me that I longer have to see him, Proof enough for you?

          • jerry hamilton

            It often does for a short while. Then you’r dead.

          • Peter Harris

            And you still have to pay the parasites of a pharmaceutical / medical industrial complex, tens of thousands of dollars for the “treatment.”

          • AutismDadd

            Bee yuk buk buk

          • TagMan

            Mate SURELY you are going to THANK him? I really thought higher of you than that LOL

          • joe

            No Tom, don’t block, ignoring hurts more.

          • AutismDadd

            wrong as always joe

          • TagMan

            The Einstein College of Medicine believes it does. I think I’d take their word over yours dunkhead! The number of people who are supposedly “cured” by chemo and then the cancer “comes back” would seem to confirm that. Almost EVERY person who comes to me is in that situation. Just because a no hoper/non person like you says it doesn’t isn’t very convinincing mate.

          • tomonthebay

            Documentation?

          • joe

            Don’t hold your breath waiting.

          • tomonthebay

            Still waiting on documentation of your claim that chemo spreads cancer.

          • TagMan

            Sorry – i know I’m wasting my time – I already told you where to find it but here goes…
            https://www.einstein.yu.edu/search/?q=chemotherapy&searchType=web

          • tomonthebay

            Haven’t read the article yet. Read the summary you provided. I will concede that it raises some interesting questions about that particular cancer. I note it also included a strategy to prevent what appears to have happened. I will read the actual article when I get a chance.

          • AutismDadd

            tom doesn’t like anything with the name Einstein in it. He likes Duck Dynasty better.

          • joe

            Well I have had Chemo, so I should be full of Cancer and yet I am not.

          • TagMan

            Sighhh – in the immortal words of all the “players” (didn’t want to use the other word) here… the fact that one person survives cancer on chemo doesn’t discount in the SLIGHTEST, all those who DON’T.

          • joe

            And of course YOU know exactly how many don’t, yeah right.

          • TagMan

            Well according to the statistics I’ve seen Joe fewer than 97% last more than five years? Not a very good score methinks?

          • joe

            Methinks you have improper statistics.

          • joe

            The claim was was that “Chemo spreads” Cancer, well I know eleven others and my self that had Chemo and the Cancer did not spread. Do you have any evidence that shows Chemo is responsible for spreading Cancer?

          • TagMan

            Sorry I have too much integrity to share people’s private information on a public platform tom. Not the done thing old boy…

          • tomonthebay

            So you got nothing.

          • TagMan

            Read the Einstein College of Medicine review on that and think again oh stupid one!

          • AutismDadd

            tom is wearing his Duck Dynasty slippers and drinking coffee in one of their mugs.

          • jerry hamilton

            Kemo is very well known to spread cancer.
            Often when cancer doesn’t kill you, kemo does.
            You call other people ignorant??????????????

          • Mike Stevens

            I see… you are a quack who sells Rife machines.
            That explains everything.

            Including this:
            ”people are becoming dumber by the day!”

          • TagMan

            Mike you are leading the team here on the “dumber each day” statement but you’ve got some SERIOUS competition from karin mate. You just might end up in second place there I’m afraid.

          • tomonthebay

            Even Dr. Andrew Weil knows that Rife machines are a fraud.

          • Peter Harris

            So what cures do you know of, in conventional mainstream medicine?

          • Karin

            Lol

          • AutismDadd

            tom knows bullets end lives and he likes to brag about killing animals grazing on grass.

          • TagMan

            Yes but if it hasn’t been clinically tested then how do we know it’s true AD? I mean if these guys really BELIEVED the crap they spew you’d think they’d be willing to take one in the head to prove their theory wouldn’t You? Volunteers? Karin? Joe? Acleron? Funny that!!!

          • Karin

            You can see how flawed that logic is, right? Lol

          • AutismDadd

            Yea take one for Team Science

          • Peter Harris

            Courageous little Tom Thumb isn’t he.
            But I enjoy it when he actually shoots himself in the foot, which is a regular occurrence.

          • AutismDadd

            Peter have you heard how they are “curing” peanut allergies lately? By giving very small amounts over time or with a patch. Basically Homeopaths were already doing it, but Mainstream Medicine is stealing its thunder while doing the same thing.

          • Karin

            That is hilarious! You have just revealed your lack of understanding of both how immunotherapy works, as well as how Homeopathy is supposed to work. They are not the same by any means. You just made that up, didn’t you? It’s more of a comedy skit than credible scientific argument

          • AutismDadd

            No. You have exposed yourself as someone who not only fails to see the similarity, but immediately goes into the indoctrination phase of denial w/o thinking.

          • Karin

            I have tried to find information that backs up your claim, even though, really, that is your responsibility. Can you please explain how the dosage used in immunotherapy compares to the dosage used in homeopathy?

          • AutismDadd

            OMG small doses over time to desensitize. Sound familiar? Mainstream Medicine is now claiming success even though homeopathy has previously done so. Its a rather simple exercise.

          • Karin

            What is the specific dosage used in immunotherapy, and how does it comparesto the dosage used in homeopathy?

          • AutismDadd

            Can’t do your own research?

          • joe

            He is a bundle of laughs.

          • AutismDadd

            Must be some trick shooting when his foot is in his mouth and his head up his arse. Sort of a pro-vac game of Twister

          • Peter Harris

            😅

            True…

            Little Tom thumb has actually blocked me, can you believe that? Ha ha ha.
            Can you believe it?
            He was trash talking me to others on these forums, and when I responded, he claimed I was stalking him!
            What a pithy little tactic… where he was trying to claim the high moral ground.

            As Freddie Mercury sang… ‘another one bites the dust…’

          • AutismDadd

            Freddie was a biter? Who knew. Maybe tom is a biter..

          • Peter Harris

            Well Tom Thumb did strike up a close relationship with Joe.
            Although, it was a relationship of Convenience, because he needed the stupidest guy on these threads to help out with his argument that I was stalking him.

          • AutismDadd

            I have to agree. joe is a yes man and his appeal to authority is chronic.

          • AutismDadd

            tom is a big baby. He defends Pharma by denying adverse reactions are anything but rare and mild and of course one in a million vaccines.

          • Peter Harris

            Just another example of the “patient’s” pain for the medical industrial complexs’ profit.

          • TagMan

            Your Dr. weil probably doesn’t know a DAMN thing about Rife and is probably on the pharmaceutical payroll so… what’s your point?

          • AutismDadd

            Yea Weil is so commercial He’s more a celebrity like Dr Phill.

          • joe

            “I AM a scientist”—- no just a big joke.

          • TagMan

            Of COURSE not!! Even if a THOUSAND people died from breathing a toxic gas that is NOT proof that it is actually poisonous right Karin? Not until it has been peer reviewd in a lab does it become real and until then – you would be TOTALLY unfazed at being asked to take a sniff right – because after all – as the almighty acleron would tell us – “it’s only anecdotal!.”

            See this is where you and the aclerons and the joe(pig)farmers of the world are COMPLETE and UTTER hypocrites! I would bet all the money I have ever earned that if any ONE of you saw someone drop dead from sniffing some substance, there is NO way in the WORLD that YOU would take a sniff and yet according to you guys – until it has been “clinically…” GOD you know the rest… it isn’t true. PLEASE let me test each of you on my little theory… PLEASEEE???
            Do you see how COMPLETELY stupid your argument is? No I didn’t think so har har.

          • Karin

            You cannot call yourself a scientist and show such an appalling knowledge of the scientific method. You’re embarrassing yourself, sir.

          • TagMan

            Karin you seem to be the expert on computer research – how do you explain the STILL AVAILABLE front page news articles with the top medics of the period LINING UP to get their pictures taken with Rife and giving him accolades for the number of people he was curing of cancer? And NO SIDE EFFECTS karin – unlike your brutal chemo and radiation therapies!

          • TagMan

            karin – electronics can power whole countries, send messages into space, drive cars, educate, provide light, look into the body in a myriad of different ways (EEG, ECG, X-RAY, MRI, CT-SCAN), connect people around the world, analyse data (including medical data), cook food, heat, shatter kidneystones and SO much more but you can’t even CONTEMPLATE that it could POSSIBLY kill a pissy little cancer cell? Those babues are WAY to clever and tough for electonics eh karin? The mind BOGGLES girl. Even with all my experience of idiots and “doubters” in the past I never DREAMED there could be people as dumb as you and your cronies on this site. How you manage to breathe and chew gum at the same time would make a FASCINATING “peer reviewed study” har har.

          • TagMan

            OMG karin – you are an obvious posterchild for the pharmaceutical industry. I was IN new Zealand when Dr Milan Bryck came up with chemotherapy and was kicked out of the country by the medical profession for what they called the stupidest idea imaginable. So he went to Fiji to continue his work where one of the pharmaceutical companies realised there was an absolute TRAINLOAD of money to be made from it and they are SO powerful that the very group that kicked him out now HAS to offer chemo as the primary treatment for cancer. For god’s sake Karin – how may people do even YOU know who have been “cured” by chemotherapy and then had it “come back” and be told “chemo won’t work any more. Unbelievable!

          • Acleron

            Milan Brych? You are getting desperate to bring him up. He was barred from practicing medicine because it was found that when he claimed he was studying medicine at Brno, he was actually in jail. He moved to the Cook Islands where a nearby cemetery was nicknamed the Brychyard because it contained so many of his dead patients. Then onto America where he was convicted of practicing medicine without a licence. You support dangerous frauds.

          • TagMan

            See acleron – you can’t even read and comprehend a simple POST let-alone a scientific DOCUMENT. I was SUPPORTING Mr Brych? REALLY? Saying that the medical profession claimed chemotherapy was the STUPIDEST idea and kicked him out of the country was SUPPORTING him acciebaby? WOW! You and I have a TOTALLY different understanding of the English language! They average FOUR year-old would have clearly seen that i was DISPARAGIING him. WOW. I APOLOGISE – up until now I was granting you at least a GLIMMER of intelligence but WOW. I couldn’t have been more WRONG!

          • Acleron

            You are right, you couldn’t be more wrong, you reached rock bottom a long time ago.

          • TagMan

            See there you go again accie you big pussy – slinging out the abuse but NEVER answering or even ADDRESSING a legitimate question… and I know – it’s because you’re not capable – i’m sorry for getting frustrated with you baby – kiss kiss (YIKES)!!

          • AutismDadd

            That’s all Acleron AKA big pussy ever does. Plus the odd tantrum

          • Karin

            The evidence about the effectiveness of chemotherapy is incontrovertible. When you ask how many people I know, that doesn’t mean anything. Despite that, I will tell you that I know many since I myself had my life saved by chemotherapy and since I’ve gotten to know many other cancer survivors. But that is wholly irrelevant. One person’s experience tells us nothing about the larger trends

            I already posted one study from the Lancet about people such as myself who are surviving in high rates because of chemotherapy. I have more.

          • Karin

            http://cancerres.aacrjournals.org/content/68/21/8643.full.pdf
            Read this for info. It’s by Vincent T. DeVita, Jr. and Edward Chu Yale Cancer Center, Yale University School of Medicine, New Haven Connecticut.

            It ends off saying that “in 1990, the national incidence and mortality of cancer began to decline. Mortality has continued to decline each year since 1990, and in 2005, overall deaths from cancer have declined despite the larger and older U.S. population. In 2007, the rate of decline actually doubled. Whereas half of this decline is due to prevention and early diagnosis, the other half is largely due to advances in cancer treatment, much of it due to the inclusion of chemotherapy in most treatment programs.”

          • TagMan

            REALLY – and how does that fit with the current projection of Canada Health that one in two Canadians can expect to have cancer in their liftetime? That’s a DIMINISHMENT? Wow – ok – maybe I DO need to go back to school!

          • Karin

            High school science classes might be helpful. Yes.

          • Verna Lang

            Wait, you were in NZ when the idea of chemotherapy came up in the 1940s? And was tested by: “two prominent Yale pharmacologists, Alfred Gilman and Louis Goodman examined the therapeutic effects of mustard agents in treating lymphoma.” Cool story, bro. Totally unbelievable and easily debunked, but cool for the sheer scale of the bollocks.

          • TagMan

            I said Dr, Brych was the one who brought it to the forefront Verna – DAMN you guys are good at selective reading. Dumber than a sack of doorknobs but amazing at picking an choosing.

          • Verna Lang

            I’m sorry, but I am poor at reading invisible lines, or as you refer to them, as between the lines. I was not supposed to interpret “I was IN new Zealand when Dr Milan Bryck came up with chemotherapy and was kicked out of the country by the medical profession for what they called the stupidest idea imaginable” or “pharmaceutical companies realised there was an absolute TRAINLOAD of money to be made from it” to mean that your whole comment was all about a huge mistake on your part about where and when chemotherapy originated.
            It’s not my fault you don’t check your facts or write in such a sloppy manner or that someone would have to be telepathic in order to correctly interpret your meaning.

          • TagMan

            No – they just need a BRAIN verna – something SADLY LACKING in you and your cronies here. I spelled his name wrong OH WHOA I SHOULD BE BEHEADED – THE WORLD IS GOING TO COLLAPSE – TAGMAN SPELLED A NAME WRONG!!! The POINT,,, oh braindead one, was that it was seen by the medical profession as a BLOODY STUPID idea. And how mikey poohs could POSSIBLY have read my statement (spelling mistakes and all) as SUPPORTING brych is completely beyond me.

            Do you still need an interpreter deary?

          • Verna Lang

            Yes, I do believe I do need an interpreter. I don’t read derpish as fluently as you spew it, but I will do my best to respond to whatever you tortured some electrons into showing.
            1. Did I say anything about spelling? No. Someone else pointed that out.
            2. Did I say anything about the opinion of the medical profession? No. I put it in bold to emphasize that you thought chemotherapy must have been a radical new idea at the time. My opinion on any such doctors who scoffed at the concept of chemotherapy at the time of Brych? They were extremely remiss in keeping up with reading medical literature. Or did it take 15 or more years to get the most recent medical journals to NZ?
            3. Did I say anything about you supporting Brych? No again. Confusion seems to be your default attitude when you are replying.
            4. Did I say that it was ridiculous that everything you wrote pointed toward your belief that Brych came up with the idea of chemotherapy? Ding, ding, ding. Yes! Brych was all of about 4 or 5 when the initial chemotherapy experiments were tried. It’s called an anachronism, deary.

          • TagMan

            Oh dear – this really gets tiresome… I was talking about quote “you and your CRONIES sweetie – NOT you in isolation and it WAS after Brych, that chemo hit the world. Sure can’t match you (and your cronies) on pedantics verna.

          • Verna Lang

            Oh dear – that must have been exhausting. Why else would you take two months to respond to my post. In that time, you obviously did no research to determine that chemotherapy was in existence for decades at the time Brych was conning people with his phony laetrile ‘cancer treatments.’ Doctors were scoffing because he was a charlatan, not because he was practicing anything remotely like actual chemotherapy.

          • TagMan

            Verna get OVER yourself girl – i have SO many more important things to do than play with silly pople like – you know – like “HEALING” people! I got a rare “spare moment” so thought I’d pop in for some entertainment and discovered widdle ol YOU. It is FASCINATING that you (AND your ilk) seem to think that when you get your medical degree you ALSO get equipped with a good heart, and a large dose of honesty and integrity but VERNA – they are PEOPLE and people LIE and do TERRIBLE things. Think about the DISGUSTING things that German doctors were doing in the second world war girl. They have families to feed – JUST like US, they LIKE their big fat paychecks, and only a rare FEW are willing to risk losing their licences by going up agains “big bad pharma.” Verna CHECK THE STATISTICS – over 250,000 people die EACH YEAR in North America to MEDICAL MISADVENTURE – more than ALL the shooting events, road kill and deaths to alternative medicine ALL PUT TOGETHER!!! And those “PEERS” that you so revere who do those studies… THEY are people TOO – ON the PAYROLL verna – THEY LIE TOO – it’s been PROVEN on many occasions. And lying can also be by OMISSION verna… Wake UP you silly little person – if you think I can’t handle lil ol YOU you are out of your MIND. I just don’t usually have the time to waste. So take your drugs sweetie with their 30 or so potential side effects (incluindg DEATH) – if that makes more sense to you then good luck to you – all I ask is that YOU acquire some (uncommon) decency and allow others to choose that which WORKS!

          • AutismDadd

            Verna….buh wah ha ha I can just see her sucking back on a cigarette while chugging a LARGE coffee

          • Mike Stevens

            “I said Dr, Brych was the one who brought it to the forefront Verna – DAMN you guys are good at selective reading.”

            No, not selective reading, just accurate reading.
            Here is what you stated:
            “I was IN new Zealand when Dr Milan Bryck came up with chemotherapy.

            That implies he was the one who invented/developed the concept. If someone “comes up with” something, we expect that to be a novel idea, mechanism, product, whatever.

            The fake doctor and fraudulent con-artist Brych (note how to spell his name) “came up with” nothing, except a new way to kill people at the same time as he was taking their money.

          • TagMan

            That is how it was presented at the time sweetie – that Brych (and that is how I spelled it the first time), had created it. I wasn’t interested in finding out if that was true or not – i was more interested in the comments of the medical profession you silly LITLLE man,,,

          • sabelmouse

            lol! 🙂

          • Mike Stevens

            I think Taggy lives not only on a different planet, but in a different time zone.

            His pet cancer quack (Brych) had a cemetery nicknamed after him, he had killed so many of his clients.

          • Peter Harris

            That website does not qualify, for anything, except for sheer lunacy and extreme medicine mongering, disease profit-making.

          • Karin

            I have no idea what you are talking about. I’m pretty sure I don’t care either.

          • Karin

            Here is another example of you dismissing an article without having read it, and without evaluating The credibility of the writer. Have a look again at the author before dismissing it. There is no profits made off that publication and there is nothing lunatic about the writer

          • AutismDadd

            Writers can be biased. It influences their work.

          • Karin

            Here’s one study for you. It’s indisputably credible.

            From The Lancet. This is the study that cites the meds that happened to save my life. It’s from the Clinical Trial Service Unit at the University of Oxford, and is called “Comparisons between different polychemotherapy regimens for early breast cancer: meta-analyses of long-term outcome among 100,000 women in 123 randomised trials.”

            It’s considered one of the most compelling, credible reviews of the evidence of the impact of chemotherapy for breast cancer. http://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736%2811%2961625-5/abstract

            The study looked at 10,000 women, and 123 randomised peer reviewed trials, over 40 years. It was a meta-analyses of long-term outcome among breast cancer patients. There are no more definitive ways of coming to a scientific conclusion than this.

            They found that:

            Standard chemotherapy regimens, using older drugs, halved 2 year recurrence rates and reduced recurrence over the next 8 years by about 33 percent. Overall, breast cancer mortality rates were reduced proportionally by 20-25%.

            Chemo treatments with lower doses were less effective. The higher dose regimens were more more effective, reducing breast cancer mortality by up to an additional 20%.

            To quote:
            “The more effective of these regimens offer on average a one-third reduction in 10-year breast cancer mortality”

          • AutismDadd

            Groan. Sounds like a report of OUTCOMES that don’t prove how the outcomes were proven to be linked to treatment.

          • Karin

            What specific factors were not excluded for in the research? Please be specific.

          • AutismDadd

            How would I know that? Besides its not related to what I said.

          • tomonthebay

            And Adudd once again demonstrates his complete lack of understanding of anything scientific.

          • AutismDadd

            Explain what I got wrong then. All you do is insult and post one liners

          • tomonthebay

            You’re the one that says the study doesn’t say what it says. What is your brilliant analysis of the flaws. Be specific and cite specifics.

          • AutismDadd

            tom you made a comment and now its your responsibility to lie about it.

          • Acleron

            You owe me yet another irony meter.

          • AutismDadd

            Why did you go swimming with yet another appliance?

          • AutismDadd

            tom is now my stalker

          • Peter Harris

            Ha ha, really??
            I taught him well. Ha ha ha.

          • AutismDadd

            You’re jealous because he won’t stalk you.

          • Peter Harris

            Are you stalking AutismDadd??

          • roscoe

            FFS did you even read that post ?

          • AutismDadd

            You’ll have to say please

          • Karin
          • disqus_1yb8x39w7X

            You’re providing a link from metabunk as proof ???

          • Karin

            Too hard to read? Try this by a scientist who reviewed that data
            https://www.clinicaloncologyonline.net/article/S0936-6555(05)00077-4/pdf

          • disqus_1yb8x39w7X

            Sorry I have problems reading BS

          • Karin

            All that Metabunk do is provide data to debunk. This is what they cited. https://www.clinicaloncologyonline.net/article/S0936-6555(05)00077-4/pdf

            What is your disagreement with it?

          • TagMan

            And what makes them so believable Karin – Snopes does that too but a lot of THEIR ‘debunking” has been found to be “influenced.” I will believe the word of a doctor who is NOT on the take ANY DAY over one that IS.

          • Karin

            I don’t really care who you “believe”.

          • TagMan

            And vice versa sweetie.

          • Karin

            “Sweetie”? You can’t win an argument with facts, so patronize instead. I guess that’s what happens when you don’t have a single shred of evidence to back your claims

          • TagMan

            And I really don’t care what or whom you believe karin. Facts are facts. rife technology is LEGAL in Belgium and doctors are using it to cure people there. Dr Holt was perhaps the most notable doctor using it in Australia. The medical mafia in Oz tried to have him shut down but Aussies aren’t pussies like so many over here are – they came out in force and FORCED the medical “profession” to back off. He retired around 10 years ago. The problem today is that so many of your “clinical trial” cronies are on the payroll of the pharmaceutical companies which IMMEDIATELY makes them suspect, and the pharmaceutical companies either fund or own most of the medical colleges so guess what doctors are taught?? Yep there’s a pill for EVERYTHING – just don’t pay any attention to the side effects – they don’t count haha.

            I haven’t and WOULDN’T said EVER that Rife is the answer to everything – NOTHING can make that claim but is it a better answer than much of the medical crap? HELL YES!!! NO side effects karin – imagine THAT being treated and not vomiting your heart out, not losing your hair, not having your intestinal flora wiped out, not… well the list just goes on and on.

          • JoeFarmer

            You’re a failed internet troll. Find something else to do.

          • AutismDadd

            Yea he isn’t a successful troll like you.

          • TagMan

            joebaby anything you say doesn’t count because you are as dumb as the bird that NZers love to name themselves after – the Kiwi – which never learned to fly and grubs in the dark for worms haha.

          • JoeFarmer

            Wow, it took you ten whole days to come up with that? I’m laughing so hard I can hardly keep typing!

          • Mike Stevens

            “Sorry I have problems reading”
            FTFY

          • TagMan

            Hey if DISNEY put it out they’d believe it – as long as it supported what they WANT to believe,

          • TagMan

            I have the medical statistics Karen – I learned some years ago that the alternative therapy brigade lies as much as the medical profession so i research the medical papers as well. Just because someone says it isn’t true doesn’t make it so.

          • Karin

            Independently evaluated and published data? Share it please

          • Acleron

            I would like a forum where if a claim cannot be substantiated, the posts with the claim are deleted.

          • Karin

            That would be fantastic. I agree completely. And it should be substantiated with credible science, not some random cherry-picked study

          • AutismDadd

            Careful what you wish for.

          • sabelmouse

            how lovely that would be.

          • TagMan

            Karin I’m sorry I don’t know how to “share.” The document I have is in PDF format. It is from PubMed Med.gov US National Libray of MedicineNational Institutes of Health. Results were 2.3% in Australia and 2.1% in the US

          • Karin

            You say you’re a scientist, but you don’t know how to cite a scientific publication? Give me a proper citation, and I’ll find it.

          • TagMan

            Karin it is fuckwits like you that make me think Sharia law is NOT going to be such a bad thank after-all. My unfamiliarity with this vapourware has nothing whatsoever to do with what i was trained in. But you of course can do EVERYTHING. Well I never thought i would ever hear myself say this but you are so stupid as to DESERVE to get cancer and GOOD LUCK with your chances on chemotherapy! The ONLY thing in theis life that cannot be replaced Karin is TIME and I don’t have any more to waste on you. BYE.

          • Karin

            Classy act: insulting me, wishing cancer and religious rule. You must be so proud of your argumentation skills.

            All that, and still no basic scientific citation. First year BSc students learn how to that. It really isn’t that hard.

            You’ll be pleased to know, btw, that I have already faced cancer. It was a highly aggressive advanced stage cancer that was defeated by chemotherapy. 11 years ago. (Sorry to disappoint you)

            I would never wish that on you. The disease is horrible, the treatment is really unpleasant. But I’m still here to argue with you (unfortunately for you)

            I do hope that when the day comes that you face cancer (which is highly likely, being human) that you are smart enough to choosing your treatment based on evidence of success, not absurd conspiracies and products you’re selling.

            It was nice arguing with you (not). Next time, try using evidence.

          • TagMan

            See Karin you can’t even read a simple text message let-alone a scientific document. I did NOT “wish” cancer on you… I said you “deserve to get it.” Was that too difficult for you. So you DID have cancer and you are one of the 2.1% who survive on chemo? Well good for YOU..
            I DO apologise for my post – I recognise that i have a real problem with stupid people and I have to accept that they can’t necessarily HELP being stupid – maybe you can come up with a vaccination for that? But yes… I try my best but I ultimately lose it. You are a perfect bureaucrat – “if it doesn’t meet the stipulated citeria then it doesn’t exist” mentality even though MANY of your “peer reviewed studies” have been PROVEN to have been falsified. Karin i would sooner take the word of a doctor who walks away from the plethora of handouts and even risks his/her license to expose the truth, than one who is “on the take” as most by far are. And thank God there are a growing numberwho are doing that. And evidence of success??? Karin – where is the GREATER evidence of success than SEEING cancer cells destroyed under a MICROSCOPE by frequency? Under your auspices, you would look at it and say… “Nope – that’s not happening – the last round of vaccinations I got have got me brain fogged at the moment har har. You would watch 14 or whatever people mowed down by a van and say “vehicles ability to kill groups of people has not been peer reviewed so this is a oncer… never happen again…” Cars don’t kill unless a lab says so har har. It’s MIND BOGGLING! And what if it

          • joe

            Welcome to the Cancer club, thanks to real medicine that I am still here, and yes the Chemo is awful, I had 24 weeks of it. Actually if he ever gets Cancer I hope he goes to a Homeopath for treatment and then he will see how he goes.

          • TagMan

            I’ll treat MYSELF jobaby. Why would i go to a group hose vested interest is in keeping me sick and whose success rates pale into INSIGNIFICANCE compare to mine? Damn – now that WOULD be stupid – it’d put me right up there with YOU guys – a fate WORSE than death!

          • joe

            And of course you have no evidence for your prattle.

          • TagMan

            Joe what you lowlifes don’t seem to get is that cancer is an EXTREMELY private issue for many people. I would LOVE to share some of the successes but you see I was brought up in a long gone era where people were taught RESPECT and i would NEVER break the trust that my clients have in me to satisfy the likes of you. Not that you would believe even THEM if i did.

          • Karin

            Yeah, why don’t you do that. I have seen a number of people try and fail at that approach.

          • Karin

            It’s not a club anyone of us ever chose to join. Glad we’re here to testify to the effectiveness of modern medicine.

          • TagMan

            Karin you insult me just by breathing. Sorry.

          • Karin

            I couldn’t be prouder

          • Mike Stevens

            Keep breathing, please!

          • TagMan

            Yes but try brushing your teeth once in a while – it might help with the stink around you…

          • That’s your problem, Tagman. The issue with Wakefield was via GMC and the British courts so you should be citing a court case.

            Those are cited as Loving V. Richards or whatever.

          • TagMan

            Sudes – let me spell it out… I read AN article – ONE article, in one of the MANY medical papers i read, that said he had been exonerated. I BELIEVED IT because it made TOTAL sense that he SHOULD be, but if the article was wrong, then i abjectly apologise. Feel better now?

          • What’s that got to do with backing up your claims?

          • Mike Stevens

            “if the article was wrong, then i abjectly apologise”
            The article was wrong, and I accept your abject apology.

          • TagMan

            Ahh – and you are the adjudicator on that eh Mike? A nobody from nowhere.

          • Mike Stevens

            You have one paper, which doesn’t mean that it is the final word on the issue, and that paper was roundly criticised for excluding numerous cancers where chemo has excellent results (leukaemias and lymphomas for example) and was shown to cite wrong survival information for some cancers such as ovarian cancer.

          • TagMan

            WOW and who do your think the criticism came from Mikey? Someone covering their backs perhaps?

          • TagMan

            Karin you are not IMPORTANT enough… sorry… I have SO many more worthwhile things to do than to do your research for you (like healing people). I come back here ONLY for the entertainment now. You and the team are part of a CULT – it doesn’t MATTER what you read, hear or even SEE – you are LOCKED into your silly little beliefs and NOTHING will shift you. 50% of the health professionals in Hong Kong refused to take the H1N1 vaccination – think they might have known something WE weren’t being told? The Health Minister of Finland wouldn’t allow it in the country – think SHE might have known something WE weren’t being told? Australia expected 17,000 people to die from it because the vaccine wasn’t ready and at the end of the season SEVENTEEN people had died – the LOWEST number of deaths to flu in 20 years and the ONLY year where there had been no vaccine available. Doesn’t tell you anything does it. My kids – 26 and 23 have NEVER HAD THE FLU while being SURROUNDED year after year by their vaccinated yet infected compatriots at school – every ONE of whom GOT the flu… it’s OUT there karin – you just have to have the eyes to see and the brain to RECOGNISE what you are seeing girl.

          • Karin

            “Blah blah, conspiracy, I have The Cure that no one wants you to know about, blah blah everyone’s hiding it blah blah but somehow no one knows about my magic blah blah blah, vaccines blah blah, everyone’s doing it blah blah I am special cuz I know things you don’t blah blah” you sound like every snakeskin oil salesman that ever walked this earth.

            You are not original, nor are you special. I feel sorry for the people you scam.

          • TagMan

            Ok – I would pay MONEY to see you front the 80 or so people who are still living (because of my ‘snake oil treatments’ many of which they didn’t pay a DIME for) after being sent home to DIE by your “stand next to God” doctors after their “peer reviewed cures” DIDN’T WORK; and tell them how “sad” you are for them! I would just stand back and watch them flay you alive. What disgusts me in the EXTREME karin is that you and your dumbf**k cronies would rather watch someone DIE than allow them to be given hope by another possibility – ESPECIALLY when some of those possibilities have been proven to be more successful than your revered “peer reviewed” medications. You just don’t GET lower on the scale of life than THAT!

          • Karin

            I don’t believe you. Set up a proper scientific study. Set a falsifiable hypothesis. Get your data independently gathered and reported. Publish in a credible peer reviewed journal.

            Until you achieve all that, you’re no better than any other charlatan making claims about cancer cures.

          • TagMan

            Except that I do more than make “CLAIMS” karin – I actually get RESULTS if you know what I mean. And i can’t give a big rat’s ARSE whether you believe it or NOT – the people I have TREATED are the ones who send most of my new clients to me so i guess what they KNOW, is a little more important to me than what you “BELIEVE.” See what I mean?

          • Karin

            So you have NO independent evidence of your claims of success. I thought so.

          • TagMan

            karin if you knew your butt from a hole in the ground you would know that NO alternative therapist is legally ALLOWED to claim that he/she cures anything. Only the MEDICAL MAFIA is allowed to make that claim – whether is is true or NOT!

          • joe

            Why don’t you get a real job and stop fleecing the gullible.

          • TagMan

            Actually I DO have a “real job” as you would put it lostthefarmjoe – there is NO way that i could continue treating people for FREE if i didn’t. Can you see the sense in that mate – I know your dumbf*ck AUSSIE ‘n all but hopefully that’s not too tough for you?

          • joe

            As you have stooped to name calling, I will no longer reply to you.

          • TagMan

            Thanks Joe – I REALLY appreciate that. Have a good life and enjoy your pharmaceuticals. Oh and make sure you keep your “shots” up to date mate, and watch out for the crocodiles – they don’t usually get their shots so who knows WHAT they might be carrying??

          • tomonthebay

            No. Karin is right. You have nothing.

          • TagMan

            Oh… karin’s knight in dull armour has arrived… so what do YOU have oh hero of the day?

          • tomonthebay

            I see a bunch of claims from you but no documentation.

          • joe

            370 people died from Flu in Australia last year.I know because I live in Australia, so stop lying,

          • TagMan

            Ahh lostthefarmjoe again. Mate you need to do YOUR research. as far as i know – H1N1 came out QUITE a few years before “last year.” See this is what I mean. You complete brain vacancies can’t even read and understand (I used comprehend last time but I’m trying to find words that you might be able to understand) a SIMPLE post here, yet you keep expecting me to believe that you read complex medical research?

          • Karin

            Hundreds of Aussies and thousands more worldwide did die from the flu last year, Tagman. And it wasnt H1N1. It was H3N2. What rock do you live under that you didn’t know that?

          • TagMan

            Karin – here we go AGAIN!!! Get a FOUR-YEAR-OLD to read my post for god’s sake. At NO point did I mention “LAST YEAR” I said the YEAR THAT H1N1 came out – 17,000 people were projected to die in Australia…” How can I POSSIBLY take ANYTHING any of you guys say with a grain of SALT when you can’t even follow the SIMPLEST post here. The mind BOGGLES!!!

          • Karin

            I missed the post where you mentioned that. Sorry. No need for further insults.

          • TagMan

            THANK you karin and I DO admit – I lose all semblance of aplomb when dealing with those whom i deem to be idiots and I apologise. I just don’tlike being called a liar when I am categorically NOT – that gets the flame thrower running high temp. Doesn’t make it right – it just is what it is,

          • Mike Stevens

            I wouldn’t ever USE a grain of SALT. Please don’t USE that. It contains CHLORINE – a toxic gas, and SODIUM, an explosive HEAVY metal like ALL metals are. WAKE UP man! Do you want EVERYONE to be POISONED?

          • TagMan

            I APOLOGISE mike – you’re right, but I WAS talking about Himalyan PINK salt you know LOL

          • Mike Stevens

            You IDIOT. Can’t YOU see that THE FLU VACCINE is not just H1N1 but is TRIVALENT or QUADRIVALENT! God MAN wake up! ..Next YOU will claim I am NOT using enough FULLCAPS to make a valid POINT and make my comment READABLE! Recognise what you are SEEING boy! Get a FOUR year old to read my POSTS! They will understand what YOU can’t. You write like a four YEAR old and make less SENSE. So YES get one to read EVERYTHING!

          • TagMan

            I’m noticing an ongoing theme here – neither you, acciebaby, lostthefarmjoe, nor any other of the vaccine groupies here EVER respond to a legitimate question asked. All you seem capable of is to ask for “documentation” (which you would be incapable of understanding if you even took the time to read it) – blah blah blah or just COMPLETELY ignore the question because it’s beyond your comprehension. It’s apparent that there isn’t ONE ounce of logic capability in the combined “intellect” of the whole bunch of you. Interesting.

            You’re a COMMITTED bunch of useless academics who don’t know a single THING about the REAL world.

          • Karin

            So you don’t have evidence? I thought so

          • TagMan

            I’ll consider noting my research for your benefit karin when you and your dumbfuddies start answering legitimate questions instead of sidestepping them.

          • Karin

            Nice excuse.

          • TagMan

            The FACT that vaccination causes add/adhd/autism etc was “debunked” too but Dr Wakefield has now been exonerated and is suing the magazine that cost him his license. What it comes down to is that many people will believe what they WANT to believe and nothing on god’s earth will change that.

          • Acleron

            Wakefield has not been exonerated except by some lunatics. Wakefield has tried to sue the BMJ twice already. It is a major source of income. He begs money from his only demographic, antivaxxers and then quickly withdraws, pocketing the excess. In the UK he withdrew because the BMJ was allowed to introduce evidence presented at the GMC hearing. The judge was not amused by this tactic.

            It is interesting that an antivaxxer goes on belief. Others go where the evidence leads and the evidence shows that Wakefield is an unethical fraud.

          • TagMan

            COMPLETELY WRONG (as usual Acle) – the anti vaxxers have done more research typically, than most doctors – it is you “believers” who don’t know shit. There is not ONE doctor that I have met who has actually RESEARCHED, who still vaccinates their families! Even Dr. Oz on tv finally admitted that he doesn’t. The CONCEPT of vaccination makes sense, but if you trust what is put INTO vaccinations then you are more naive than a baby! And yet you speak as though you “know” something har har.

          • Acleron

            Do you actually believe your nonsense or do you believe it will get you more sales of your scam?

            Even Dr Oz? Like yourself, Dr Oz will say anything to flog his worthless products.

          • TagMan

            Yeah but acciebaby – I DON’T make money from healing people – if i wasn’t a business consultant I would STARVE on the money that people donate mate. See SOME of us and sure as hell not YOU, try to EALLY help people and I DON’T CHARGE. I don’t know how to get that into that terminably thick skull mate but I DON’T CHARGE!!!! If I put it as a series of posts with only one word would THAT help or would you like me to find a four-year-old to explain it to you?

          • TagMan

            Gee I thought you were against slagging people accie? And your assumptions are almost as great as your level of stupidity. I don’t ‘flog” products a’hole – I will not sell a product to a client until they have had at least ONE treatment (and the first is always FREE), and have gone away to think about it and make their own decision. I’m guessing that you make the same assumptions about the efficacy of your “peer reviewed trials” (har har) and that would explain why you are so EQUALLY wrong in your comments.

          • Remind me what nationality Wakefield is, will you? Hint: It’s not American.

          • TagMan

            And your point is? I don’t care if he comes from Timbuktu – where he comes from has no relevance to anything here?

          • It absolutely does. Two things, for example: The #FollowTheMoney Trope or whether he was under control of the CDC.

          • TagMan

            Uhmm I don’t recall EVER making any mention of the “CDC” sudes – you’re not on hallocinogenics are you mate?

          • Karin

            Dr Oz? Hahaha

          • joe

            Dr Oz also supports Reiki, that should tell you something.

          • Karin
          • joe

            Why am I not surprised

          • AutismDadd

            What moronic garbage.

          • Mike Stevens

            “Dr Wakefield has now been exonerated and is suing the magazine that cost him his license”
            …still gullibly swallowing internet tropes from last decade, I see…

          • TagMan

            No species on the PLANET more gullible than those who believe doctors and pharmaceutical companies are “only interested in our best interests” (get out the violins). Mikey. a simple look at the LOGIC – YOU DON’T MAKE MONEY FROM HEALTHY PEOPLE should raise some concern, And have you noticed that it’s all about MANAGING YOUR ILLNESS now rather than actually “CURING” anyone? No – too stupid to figure THAT one out eh mate?

          • What are you talking about? Of course you make money from healthy people – what the hell do you think income tax is? Are you going to claim the CDC prosecuted Wakefield next?

          • TagMan

            Oh, doctors and pharmaceutical companies DO make money out of people who are in good health Sudy? SERIOUSLY? I never woulda figured. Sounds like one hell of a story here – I’m listening – please tell me how it is done? because TAX (as far as i understand it) is paid to the GOVERNMENT – not the pill industry.

          • Yes, income tax is paid to the government and one of the things that government then pays for via taxes is the NHS. That’s how England works.

          • TagMan

            And your point is? The “health industry” is STILL making money from managing illness rather than curing it no matter WHERE the money comes from and a PILE of their money does NOT come from from the government.-It ALSO comes from medications etc that are NOT supported by the government. Either way they win. They get paid whether you live or die.

          • No, the health industry is not making money in the UK from managing illness rather than curing it. That’s not how the UK works.

            As for the rest, evidence please. And it is your research to back up your claim that you made yourself.

          • TagMan

            Mate – engage your brain for a moment. If the medical industry gets paid by the government for every person they treat are they making money out of it or not? And if they treat more people then does that not equate to more money? Jeez the math is pretty straightforward mate. They make money out of people being ill – INDISPUTABLE!! I mean – it’s never going to happen but THINK about it for god’s sake – if NO-ONE got sick, the industry would close down.

          • Again, that’s not how the UK works, at all.

          • TagMan

            OMG – the bar is getting so LOW we’ll have to DIG for it soon. So you’re saying in the UK the government pays the medical industry but the medical industry doesn’t make money, and if there was no one sick the medical industry would still be paid by the government but they wouldn’t be making money and if EVERYONE was sick the government would pay but the medicos STILL wouldn’t be making money? DAMN I need a coffee – my head is spinning trying to grasp this one.

          • If you get rid of the assumption that everywhere operates a for-profit healthcare system; everything becomes much easier to grasp.

            The government sets a budget for the NHS. Everything comes out that budget; drugs, wages, beds, linen, food, every hospital thing comes out of that budget.

            More healthy people = more income tax = more to put back in the NHS budget. It’s in their financial interests to actually do things to help people. Plus catching stuff earlier means it’s cheaper and easiser to treat.

            And even if they cured every disease and illness known to man; people would still have babies, right?

          • TagMan

            Sudanese – you are making no sense at all. Just because an industry is “not for profit” doesn’t mean for a MOMENT that it isn’t making HUGE amounts of money – remember the CEO of the worldwide “Save the Childrens fund earning over $2,000,000 a year? The whole POINT of the “managing your illness” program is to keep you sick so the money keeps rolling in but not SO sick that you die. I am AMAZED that you can’t see that.

          • Got any evidence for this claim?

          • TagMan

            OMG – I read an article about it a couple of years ago – amongst a HOST of things I read Suds. As strange as it may seem – I DON’T keep a database of every paragraph of every publication I have read with dates, times, references and so on, expecting that I’ll have to defend my statement sometime in the next 50 years or so.. I really didn’t know that there are people who do that?

          • First, I can’t search for an article that Tagman read a couple of years ago. Do you remember the magazine name even or anything I can search for?
            Second, you’re being asked to defend a statement you made less than a month ago.
            Third, what has what other people do or not do got to do with backing up your claims that you made yourself?
            Four: You’re on the internet. If you remember any phrase, you can just google that.

          • It’s called the national health service. And they get their money from taxes – one of those taxes is the income tax. So it’s in their financial interest to keep people healthy enough to work, at least.

          • AutismDadd

            You are witnessing the Rake at his best…sort of

          • sabelmouse

            people do have some weird ideas about healthcare outside the usa.

          • TagMan

            Geez i must have been on a slow day here Suds – you are saying the GOVERNMENT makes money from people who are well – YESSS but I was talking about the MEDICAL industry not making money and I missed that you slipped the government in. So I still go with my original post – the Pharmaceutical and Medial industries don’t make money from healthy people. Hopefull we’re on the same page now.

          • Insurance companies do though.

          • Karin

            That is hilarious! It is pathetic how, despite years and millions of cases of evidence of the effectiveness of vaccines, all that the anti-vaxxers still have to hang on to the rantings of one single hack, who was completely discredited.

            Wakefield was not exonerated. He still has no medical license to practice.

            The only thing that’s going to change people’s minds is fact. And there are know facts to back up his claims

          • TagMan

            UNTRUE – there are a HOST of articles on the web concerning this but Karin for gods SAKE – using just one OUNCE of logic, how do you suppose that putting TWO neurotoxins in vaccinations (aluminium and mercury) DIRECTLY into the bloodstream is NOT going to cause a neurological disease? Stupid is as stupid gets as they say. But you are a believer Karin and I accept that NOTHING will change that until maybe, one of your own goes down.

          • TagMan

            There is NO evidence WHATSOEVER to support the “effectiveness” of vaccines karin – PERIOD!! Just because most peoples immune systems are able to overcome the DETRIMENTAL effects of vaccines doesn’t mean they are in ANY way “successful.” What IS in evidence is the TENS of thousands of people who have been HARMED by vaccinations all over the world. Why do you think the US govt (under obummer I believe but don’t quote me) made it so you can’t SUE the bastards now? I don’t know that you actually HAVE feelings but how WOULD you feel having FORCIBLY vaccinated your own child and have him/her completely debilitated for the rest of his/her life, when what you were vaccinating him/her AGAINST would have been FAR less impacting – that is in the UNLIKELY event that they would have caught it ANYWAY?? You’ll probably say “it was in the best interests of the world” eh karin and your poor child would be left an existence that a FEELING person wouldn’t wish on ANYONE, because “mummy” believed everything the people in white coats say. SICKENING – absolutely SICKENING!! Disease is and always HAS been CYCLIC karin – it comes and goes, and no stupid vaccination is going to stop it. Nature is more powerful than your folks in white coats could ever PERCEIVE.

          • Karin

            Riiiiiight. And I’m going to take the word of some rando on the internet over the scientific consensus. I. don’t. Think. So.

          • tomonthebay

            Are you deluded, stupid or both?

          • joe

            BOTH

          • Peter Harris

            It’s amusing, yet predictable, that troglodytes, such as yourself, can’t mount an intellectual argument regarding the subject matter, so you always resort to the School Yard ad hominem.

          • joe

            Tell me, how many people died from measles every year in the U.S.A. BEFORE vaccination became available.

          • TagMan

            NO idea josey but I know PISS ALL died in New Zealand – NONE of my friends did and nearly ALL of the kids at my school got it, and neither did my son die (my daughter never got it and don’t tell anyone – she wasn’t vacciinated either – snorkle yak).

          • joe

            So “no idea” speaks volumes for your intelligence.

          • joe

            What’s wrong TagMan, my question too difficult for you.?

          • In that case, you’ll have no trouble citing the full original court case where Wakefield was exonerated and be sure to tell us what magazine you’re talking about.

            Please note I asked for FULL as in not an excerpt. Please note I said ORIGINAL as in not John Stone or anyone else’s take on it but the actual court case. Please note I said Wakefield, not Walker-Smith or anyone else. Please note I said magazine and not journal or newspaper.

          • TagMan

            ahh sudy boy – I’m sorry I read this stuff for my OWN education – not to educate others – even though I can see here that DAMN there is a shortfall… So, never having anticipated that I would have an opportunity to meet up with some of the dumbest people on the planet, I haven’t logged and dated every exerpt i have read over the course of my lifetime and I am not here to do other’s research FOR them… SORRY…

          • Tagman, why on earth do you think it is my research to back up your claim that you made yourself? Whose else’s responsibility would it be to back up claims that you made yourself? The Blue Fairy’s?

          • TagMan

            I’m not asking you to back up MY claims sudy – I do my research for MY interest – I’m just suggesting that you do the same.

          • Then why, when challenged to back up your claim that you made yourself, did you tell someone to do their own research?

          • TagMan

            Jeez I’m getting worried for you sudes? I believe if i re-read my statements that I saiid I read for MY interest – not others, and because i don’t read with the purpose of entering into arguments with complete stuffwits, I don’t meticulously enter everything I read along with dates, addresses etc. into a database (although i do design databases for my own use I have to admit). I read an article that said that he had been exonerated,,, if the article was wrong then it was wrong – big deal… None of you geniouses YET though, have made ANY attempt to explain how you can put not one but TWO neurotoxins DIRECTLY into the bloodstream, and NOT have a neurological affliction as the outcome? I’d REALLY be interested in that and would even QUOTE you, if it made any sense.

          • Karin

            Actually, the burden of proof is on you. You have to prove that each of those ingredients is a neurotoxin. And you would have to prove that they are in a high enough dose to cause anything negative. Again, you are proving your lack of knowledge when it comes to the scientific method. You make the claim, then you have to prove it. You cannot prove a negative. You have to prove that those are toxins in the doses that they are injected

          • Again, I don’t see whose interest you read it for has anything to do with backing up your claim that you made yourself.

            But basic principles of toxicology.

            https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/0067bbc5c07a4208ee591f6d41985d47e4be5f685f93e93f23c02c8d788a022c.jpg

          • Mike Stevens

            “None of you geniouses YET though, have made ANY attempt to explain how you can put not one but TWO neurotoxins DIRECTLY into the bloodstream, and NOT have a neurological affliction as the outcome?”

            And I already answered you. Your question is nonsensical.
            1. Vaccines are not injected DIRECTLY into the bloodstream, and
            2. None of the constituents are toxic in the doses found in vaccines.

          • TagMan

            Oh my GOD – I had no idea Mike – so they inject them up the ARSE now? Woohoo!! And aluminium and mercury are not toxic? Well DAMN THAT shoots down a lot of scientific research DOESN’T it? I guess everyone should go get all those amalgam fillings put back in cos good ol’ Mike says it’s not toxic anymore and if MIKE says it – you gotta BELIEVE it (unless of course you have a brain) LOL.

          • Mike Stevens

            “Dr Wakefield has now been exonerated and is suing the magazine that cost him his license”

            There are at least 5 things wrong in that single sentence… I think that may be a record, even for the internet nutjobs like yourself.

            1. He is not a “Dr” any more.
            2. He was never exonerated – you are referring to a case where one of his co-authors appealed the GMC charges and had them dismissed because the court was informed that this doctor was misled by Wakefield.
            3. He isn’t suing anyone (He always says he will sue people, asks his gullible cult members for funds, but then bottles out of ever doing the “suing” part, and pockets the cash).
            4. He did threaten to sue the British Medical Journal for calling him a scientific fraudster. That is not a “magazine”, but a medical journal.
            5. The BMJ didn’t “cost him his license”. He was found guilty of serious professional misconduct by the GMC. Perhaps you get confused by 3-letter abbreviations?

          • TagMan

            Oh MIKEY… you ASTONISH me with your meticulous BRILLIANCE – KISS KISS KISS… so please explain – why is autism, ADHD, ADD and so on becoming more widespread by the day and please advise how putting TWO – not one but TWO neurotoxins, DIRECTLY into the bloodstream is NOT going to lead to a neurological affliction. This should be good…

          • Mike Stevens

            Keep posting, Taggy, so everyone can see how stupid you antivaxers are…

          • TagMan

            Nahhh I can’t compete with the stupidity of people like you mike – you get the prize. I might come back for the entertainment but hey – I have PEOPLE to heal – unlike you who haven’t done a single worthwhile thing in your life. SAD little puppy… go kiss a mirror – I’m sure it will make you feel better pussy…

          • Mike Stevens

            You’re right. I feel better already.

          • TagMan

            Awesome – I just KNEW it would – congratulations – now you have something more worthwhile to do with your time.

          • joe

            Unlike YOU Mike is a real doctor, and your contribution to society would be what?

          • TagMan

            81% of the people I have treated CURED!!! WOOHOO and that’s not counting the people I’ve treated with MS, parkinsons, arthritis, anxiety, autoimmune disorders, blood disorders, bronchial issues, colitis, irritable bowel syndrome… the list goes on and on. So what about YOU joey – what contribution have YOU made (besides breathing oxygen that should be reserved for people with BRAINS)? In eleven years joey – the ONLY thing that has COMPLETELY stumped me is stupidity. I’m not a quitter but I think I’m going to have to give up on that one and you and some of your cronies here have totally confirmed that for me haha.

          • joe

            I can compile a list like you, without evidence like you, I could say that I am a scientist. I think you are all B.S.

          • TagMan

            And everyone can see what great dancers you “vaxxers” are – expert in the “sidestep” – NEVER answer a question – just sidestep it with some inane comment. WOW. And you actually think you are “smart?”

          • Mike Stevens

            I do answer any reasonable, intelligent question anyone asks me, but yours was clearly complete nonsense, and it has previously been answered anyhow.

            “please advise how putting TWO – not one but TWO neurotoxins, DIRECTLY into the bloodstream is NOT going to lead to a neurological affliction.”

            1. The constituents are not toxic at the doses found in vaccines.
            2. They are not injected DIRECTLY into the bloodstream; no vaccine is.

            …Happy now?

          • TagMan

            You’re SERIOUSLY constipated Mike – you need to get that checked – you just can’t STOP talking shit mate. So you’re saying there’s no blood where they stick those needles eh? Ok that confirms it – it’s a LONG time since I got a vaccination (had no choice in the military) so i didn’t know they’d shifted the insertion point. So it’s up the arse now eh? Interesting – no WONDER so many of you guys love getting your shots. Explains a LOT – thanks man!

          • AutismDadd

            Coffee enemas for all the pro-vacs

          • TagMan

            And make theirs HOT!!! LOL.

          • AutismDadd

            McDonalds lawsuit hot

          • joe

            What a Maroon.

          • TagMan

            Yes but by WHOM – what makes you think your source is any more credible than any OTHER?

          • Karin

            It’s called The Scientific Method. Read up on it some time.

          • TagMan

            So you say – doesn’t make it believable though. and you’ve avoided the question about the 50% of canadians expected to get cancer in their lifetime – as usual…

          • Karin

            I did not see you ask that question. That’s an easy trend to understand. “About 45 per cent of those cases will occur in people age 70 and older, said Smith, noting that as more people move into old age, the number of cancer cases will rise.

            Despite the projection that cancer will cause the deaths of one in four Canadians, cancer mortality rates have been declining since their peak in 1988. Over the past three decades, deaths due to cancer have fallen by more than 30 per cent among men and by about 17 per cent among women.”

            Longer lifespans, less deaths from other causes. Cancer is still primarily a disease of aging. http://www.cbc.ca/news/health/cancer-society-annual-statistics-report-1.4168784

          • Peter Harris
          • Karin

            nothing in that article contradicts my statement.

          • Karin

            I don’t know if i saved my last reply, so I’ll repeat it. There’s a common sense explanation for the data that 1 in 2 Canadians will get cancer in our lifetimes. Canadians are living longer than ever before and are less likely to get other diseases. Cancer is still mostly a disease of aging.

            http://www.cbc.ca/news/health/cancer-society-annual-statistics-report-1.4168784

          • Karin

            You don’t seem to understand between actual science that has been repeated and done on a large scale , in human subjects, vs anecdotes and reports.

          • Mike Stevens

            I see Taggy’s flounce didn’t last too long….
            😂

          • Karin

            😂😂😂😂😂

          • TagMan

            What a pathetic little comment mikey – I have other things to do besides play games with idiots – more IMPORTANT things – you know – like HEALING people? But you wouldn’t know what it means to help a person at that level would you mike – still trying to work out how to play with yourself!

          • AutismDadd

            Are you claiming all science has been repeated on a large scale? And claim every possible situation has been studied to that extent?

          • Karin

            More so than any of the alternatives…

          • AutismDadd

            So no and a mild deflection.

          • jerry hamilton

            Not so mild, natural remedies were outlawed and jail was the answer to numerous doctors because of it.
            These people don’t want to know the truth.

          • TagMan

            Ahh – we don’t do “peer reviewed studies” in electronic warfare karin Chortle… snort…

          • TagMan

            karin is there any more frustrating person on the PLANET than you? There are thousands of MILLIONS of things in this world that do their thing in SPITE of the fact that karin hasn’t had them “peer reviewed” in a clinical test for god’s sake. All your “clinical tests” do is to satisfy the needs of the OCD afflicted like you.
            I will put my whole reputation against the FACT that a bullet in the head will kill you almost EVERY time and it doesn’t give a BIG RAT’S ARSE about whether it has been “clinically tested” or not. And there are a HOST of treatments out there that DON’T WORK or work in just a tiny number of cases only – even after having BEEN “peer reviewed.” If the world had to wait upon your “peer reviews” to substantiate that it was real – it would have fallen over right at the start. If something works – it WORKS – if it doesn’t work – it DOESN’T WORK karin and all the “peer reviews in the WORLD aren’t going to CHANGE that! SHEESSHHH!!

          • jerry hamilton

            You seem to be oblivious to corporate corruption.
            One of America’s greatest achievements.

          • Mike Stevens

            Debunked claims.. I suggest you stop spreading lies.
            See here:
            https://respectfulinsolence.com/2011/09/16/two-percent-gambit-chemotherapy/

          • AutismDadd

            ORAC’S cite? Talk about shilling Mike

          • Peter Harris

            Gorski, the scum of the earth.

          • AutismDadd

            Yep a professional grade shill. Hey have you engaged David? Not David W , just David.

          • TagMan

            Debunked by WHOM? YOU? har har har – that would be about right!

          • TagMan

            Debunked by whom Mike – the industry that makes the most money ffom maintaining the staus quo? Now THEY would be a believable bunch for SURE!

          • Peter Harris

            A link to that mad Gorski?
            Oh yes, that works for ya.

          • TagMan

            The OPINION of one man – that’s no better than what you are accusing your “opponents” here of??
            And you call ME a liar – have you looked up the information re the guy in NZ mike? A DAMN site more REAL than the crap that YOU spout here and you call ME a liar? WOW!!

          • Karin

            It’s interesting how there’s not one study included in that Rife site to prove the claim. Not one published study.

          • TagMan

            Karin – it wouldn’t matter if I put a TRAIN in front of you – if there hadn’t been a “clinical – peer reviewed study” done – you wouldn’t ALLOW yourself to BELIEVE it was a train. You and your cronies COMPLETELY destroy any POSSIBILITY of credibility when on the one hand you say “if there hasn’t been a “clinical – peer reviewed study” then it’s purely anecdotal and therefore – not believable. And then you COMPLETELY contradict yourselves – over and over and over when you AVOID those things that haven’t been clinically proven, but you believe them anyway!

            Now to the best of my understanding, there has NEVER been a “clinical – peer reviewed study” to show that bullets kill so therefore, by your categoric standing, you do not BELIEVE that bullets kill and would be happy to place yourself in front of a gun and be shot right? You know damn WELL that you wouldn’t!

            If you saw even TWO people die in agony after being bitten by a spider – because it would be anecdotal you’d have NO hesitation putting YOUR arm out for a bite yes? And if ANOTHER person got bitten and in the throws of dying, they pour a substance over the bite and recover – you would again see that as anecdotal and would NOT recommend that the NEXT person bitten do the same thing right? And if YOU were bitten there’s no damn way YOU would put that “unproven crap” on YOUR arm right Karin?

            Now you and I BOTH know you would, and you shoot your WHOLE stance in the butt in the process! I would take a BET that there are MILLIONS (maybe BILLIONS) of things that haven’t been “clinically studied and proven,” yet you accept with no QUESTION that they are real – but… according to you – they’re anecdotal – so how CAN you believe THEM? COMPLETE BS!

            If something APPEARS to have helped just ONE person where nothing else has, and it hasn’t been known to cause harm in the process Karin – I’m going to give it a try. There’s nothing more to lose – and THAT is the position that most people are in who come to me. And if you think i’m going to tell them “welllll… I know a lot of people SEEM to have been helped by it but mmm… NO – karin and acleberry say it’s only anecdotal and therefore couldn’t POSSIBLY work, so sorry – you’ll just have to go home and die – that’s what the hospital said right? Best that you do what you’re told….” you could NEVER be more WRONG!! I will put everything I HAVE at risk to help another human being Karin – even if if the best I can do is to give them HOPE again, and I just can’t UNDERSTAND people like you who would stand by and watch even CHILDREN die – withholding a possible cure until it has been “peer reviewed.

            So do you see how COMPLETELY stupid your stance is karin – and how contradictory the BS that you and your cohorts post here is? And THAT is why I throw shit at you. It’s no more effective than trying to get you to open your mind to other possibilities, but it’s much more fun.

          • AutismDadd

            They do the same trick with parental reports about a child regressing and becoming autistic after a series of vaccines. They fall all over themselves and froth at the mouth blubbering about anecdotes.

          • roscoe

            Autism and vaccinations oh come on.

          • AutismDadd

            I know, you’re covered in wool.

          • roscoe

            Wooly bully AD

          • Mike Stevens

            So, …what you are saying is there isn’t a published, peer-reviewed clinical study on Rife quackery?

            Couldn’t you have just said “No”, and saved yourself having to type a 500-word screed of irrelevant garbage?

          • tomonthebay

            He can’t help himself. He is either a con man selling that junk or a true believer and can’t be reached as facts don’t matter to them.

          • TagMan

            The reason I didn’t say NO mike is because that would not be true! I don’t KNOW if there is or isn’t one for god’s sake – and i don’t bloody CARE. With my training I KNOW what can and can’t be done with electronics – I don’t need one of your pathetic “studies” to “prove it” to me, DAMN!!! You are nothing but a professional debater whose ONLY intent is to stir shit – never coming to a useful conclusion and THAT – you are good at – but what an unbelievably USELESS qualification!

          • TagMan

            No I needed to let you and your team know just how completely stupid AND hypocritical you are. “No” wouldn’t have done it mate.

          • sabelmouse

            people are weird . how brainwashed can they even be. i tell them about boegem balsem, for instance and nothing. sure, suffer with a bad burn, i prefer to have mine gone after an hour.
            it’s worse if they let their animals or children suffer rather than try something outside of what they’ve been taught is the only medicine.

          • jerry hamilton

            Hmmmm. When you don’t look, you will never find.
            You must be blissfully aware that any positive study on the removal of cancer carries jail time.
            Seems like you don’t have a clue though.

          • tomonthebay

            That takes the prize for the most deluded comment I have seen in a long, long time.

          • john tucci

            Read your comment, “removal of Cancer carries jail time”. Care to provide some proof?

          • tomonthebay

            If he has an answer it out to be entertaining. It certainly won’t be factual.

          • john tucci

            Yes I am still waiting.

          • Karin

            Oh, and your vitamin c claims have been disproven https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/384241?dopt=Abstract

          • Peter Harris

            NCBI cannot be relied upon, to give impartial, unbiased objective information regarding alternative methods.

          • Karin

            I’ve noticed this pattern of you dismissing entire publication sources without even having to read the article someone shared with you. That is so easy, isn’t it? NCBI is a source of multiple Publications. The article I shared with you is from the New England Journal of Medicine. It is eminently credible.

          • joe

            And you expect to get credible evidence from him? Not going to happen.

          • Karin

            I don’t know why I bother..

          • joe

            Best to ignore this troll. I gave up on him when he stooped to name calling.

          • Karin

            I really need to do that. You’re right.

          • Peter Harris

            So you going to ignore me? Based on Joe’s advice??
            This is the man who is an uber troll himself, and has nothing of value to add to these discussions.
            And remember, he had his disqus account wiped because of his barrage of abuse and trolling.

            I happen to get called a troll, because I am willing to be patient, and mount a cogent and intelligent argument as to why, as we enter the third Decade of the 21st century, the medical profession has failed in its duty of care.

          • AutismDadd

            I vote Karin not block you and block joe instead.

          • Peter Harris

            …😉

          • joe

            Sorry Dudd, she is NOT stupid.

          • AutismDadd

            I’ll wait to see what she says

          • TagMan

            Peter I admire you but unfortunately, your patience is COMPLETELY misplaced here mate. These people are INCAPABLE of logic which by the way karin is a HUGE part of what science is all about. The most LOGICAL discussion or explanation in the WORLD goes RIGHT OVER KARIN’S head (and her cronies). They are just not CAPABLE of understanding – ANYTHING. all they can do is post stuff and point to articles that are no more believable than the average comic book. Good luck to you.

          • Peter Harris

            Well, I don’t mind discussing this with Karin, because I think she’s a neophyte, and not part of the cabal of apologists for the pharmaceutical/Medical industrial Complex.

            I think she’s like virtually everyone else in this world, she just implicitly and explicitly trusts the medical profession, because that’s what’s ingrained in all of us since our childhood, that we should trust the doctors because they’re here to help us and heal us.

            But I think if we can change the minds of people like Karin, then it will be much easier for us to expose this nefarious industry, which is purely based around profits, prestige and politics.

          • AutismDadd

            Agree. Karin seems just that, so I’m going to be nice

          • sabelmouse

            pretty fanatic for just trusting.

          • TagMan

            You’re awesome!!!

          • AutismDadd

            Don’t do it. Ignore troll joe

          • AutismDadd

            You just called him a troll…

          • Peter Harris

            It’s a little ironic… isn’t it?

          • AutismDadd

            As the pro’s say, my Irony Meter just burnt out.

          • joe

            Amazing, you can actually read.

          • AutismDadd

            Took you this long to notice.

          • Peter Harris

            You are in the running for the hypocrite award of the year.

          • sabelmouse

            25 cents per comment?

          • AutismDadd

            I’d give her 5 cents

          • Tetenterre
          • TagMan

            I agree karin – if you can’t read – what’s the point?

          • AutismDadd

            Ever notice Karin these studies are loaded with suggestion, supposition, exaggeration, bias, opinion and conclusions by the author who found what he looked for?

          • Karin

            Give me an example from the studies I cited?

          • AutismDadd

            All you need to look for are fluff words like may, suggests, possibly, could, might etc.

          • Peter Harris

            Not true, I do read, and read often, the publications from NCBI and PubMed.

            My point is, that I don’t have any confidence in these mainstream medical publications and data analysis organisations, because they are beholden to, and part of the medical industrial complex.

            Are you going to expect to see Coca-Cola publishing positive analysis regarding their rival, Pepsi?

            Also, Ford publishing positive analysis regarding the safety and efficiency of the cars from General Motors?

            You get my picture. My point is, that mainstream medical organisations, are a total anathema to alternative practices of healing and treatment, because they see them as a rival for profit and prestige.

          • Karin

            I don’t think you understand the peer review method. It’s blind and not beholden to any funder. That’s especially true for large medical journals like the NEJM. So many of new effective treatments come from “alternative” treatments that are proven to work. Read up on Taxol, for example.

          • Peter Harris
          • Peter Harris

            If you can get this book, it might change your mind…

            “This analysis of Canada’s breast cancer movement from 1990 to 2010 argues that the resulting power imbalance undermined the groups’ ability to put patients’ interests ahead of those of the funders. A movement that once encouraged democratic participation in the development of health policy now eerily echoes the demands of the pharmaceutical industry.”

            https://www.amazon.com/Health-Advocacy-Inc-Pharmaceutical-Movement/dp/077483384X#productDescription_secondary_view_div_1526269941320

          • Peter Harris
          • TagMan

            karin karin karin – PULLLEEEZE!!! Pharmaceutical money makes it’s way into EVERYTHING “medical.” For gods SAKE girl show that you at least have a quarter lobe to your brain. The bar for stupidity must be getting close to the earth’s CORE by now. WOW!!!

          • jerry hamilton

            If you believe that, I have some of Sadams WMD I can sell you real cheap.

          • jerry hamilton

            Yes. To corporations.

          • AutismDadd

            but KARIN says so, so your goose is cooked Peter.

          • TagMan

            Ain’t that the truth – but… does karin REALLY know how to cook a goose?? LOL. I have met some stupid people in my life but even collectively, they could match the dumbarses in here!!

          • AutismDadd

            Haven’t you noticed even the “smart ones” aren’t really smart?

          • TagMan

            Oh and here is the puppydogs tail wagging again… woohoo. WRONGGG as usual karin geez i don’t think i have ever encountered anyone as plank dumb as you!

          • jerry hamilton

            Often bare faced lies is used to disprove facts.
            They even go to war and kill people to disprove facts too.

          • Mike Stevens

            Evidence from YouTube videos…?
            Don’t make me laugh.

          • TagMan

            What can I say – you probably take ten minutes EACH TIME – to figure out which end to wipe when you go to the toliet mate!

          • jerry hamilton

            Evidence from the FDA… Hilarious.

          • TagMan

            baby – you need to come to grips with the fact that although you don’t have the mentality of a peanut and therefore couldn’t even figure that icecream might go down well at a children’s party, there are things that work even THOUGH important lil’ you (and a few of your cronies here) will NEVER understant them.

          • TagMan

            And you should stop spreading manure mike. Every time you open your mouth enough shit comes out to fertilise a grow-op! That something has been “debunked” means absolutely NOTHING! Debunked by whom? What is their (real) knowledge on the subject? Whose payroll are they on? Who/what are they aligned to? What prejudices/biases do they have? Are they willing to GENUINELY open their minds to other possibilities and so on… this remains true for BOTH sides – BOTH lie, and that is why I look at the alternative healing side AND subscribe to medical journals. And beyond that I have my own training AND I still have (albeit limited) access to guys in the bacteriological warfare side of the military and they have information that is not available even to your lauded “peer review” groups.

            Anone who will not grant credibility to the medical side is a fool – like that idiot who let his son die up here, but anyone who thinks the medical side is the answer to all is equally stupid. If we could integrate the two – THEN we would have a true “healing system!” I wouldn’t CONSIDER telling someone to stop medial treatment HOWEVER much I might disagree with it, and I don’t HESITATE to tell them they need to see a doctor when I believe that to be true. I also INSIST that cancer patients i am treating go BACK TO HOSPITAL for confirmation that their cancer is gone before stopping treatment. So you see I DO have an open mind and that’s where my frustration with you and your cronies comes – you are CLOSED SHOPS, you ridicule things that you know absolutely NOTHING about, and that is just as dumb as that idiot who lost his child.

            As a scientist in the 60’s once said – give me the right computer (that would have been a mini or mainframe then so don’t BS me about PCs not being invented then) and he could “prove” everything we eat is bad for us. So ANYTHING can be convincingly debunked from EITHER side of the fence and people have to make their own balanced judgement IF they have the capacity to do that.

          • AutismDadd

            respectfulinsolence = shill trash

          • joe

            Diagnosed with brain Cancer in 2005, thanks to modern medicine I am still here and doing well. So much for your 5 year survival rate.

          • TagMan

            So you are one of the lucky ones – congratulations mate.

          • joe

            Actually there was 10 of us getting treatment together and 8 of us are still here 13 years later. Hooray for modern medicine.

          • Karin

            Same here. 11 years later. The vast majority of women who I got to know in chemotherapy are still alive and well.

            There is tons of evidence that people are living longer than ever on chemotherapy. I already chose to share one source with Tagman. I think he needs more

          • joe

            TagMan is full of it, I longer respond to him.

          • TagMan

            And I am SO grateful Joe – one less timewaster!!

          • Karin

            Hodgkin’s lymphoma is completely curable with chemotherapy.

            Read this for a summary of the evidence:

            The Role of Chemotherapy in Hodgkin’s Lymphoma
            https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2847426/

            This describes the impact of chemotherapy as a treatment for Hodgkin’s lymphoma as being 85% and 91% effective depending on the chemo regimen

          • Karin

            http://cancerres.aacrjournals.org/content/68/21/8643.full.pdf
            Read this for info. It’s by Vincent T. DeVita, Jr. and Edward Chu Yale Cancer Center, Yale University School of Medicine, New Haven Connecticut.

            It ends off saying that “in 1990, the national incidence and mortality of cancer began to decline. Mortality has continued to decline each year since 1990, and in 2005, overall deaths from cancer have declined despite the larger and older U.S. population. In 2007, the rate of decline actually doubled. Whereas half of this decline is due to prevention and early diagnosis, the other half is largely due to advances in cancer treatment, much of it due to the inclusion of chemotherapy in most treatment programs.”

          • Karin

            http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.3322/caac.21349/full

            Cancer treatment and survivorship statistics, 2016
            KD Miller, RL Siegel, CC Lin… – CA: a cancer journal …, 2016 –

            “The number of cancer survivors continues to increase because of both advances in early detection and treatment”

          • TagMan

            YOU might have survived joe but I’m not so sure about your brain mate. I’d suggest you get your head x-rayed but them x-rays haven’t been “peer reviewed” so anything they showed wouldn’t be believable right jo?

          • tw0468
          • Karin

            I won’t click on an unexplained link

          • Acleron

            It was spam, it’s all over Disqus.

          • tw0468
          • AutismDadd

            What causes cancer Karin? Ever look it up?

          • Karin

            Cancer isn’t a single disease with a single cause.

          • AutismDadd

            Surely you are curious about what caused yours. Even a quick search suggests chemical exposure and gene mutation (not inherited).

          • joe

            Wrong stupid, the cancer I had, NOBODY to this day knows what caused it.

          • AutismDadd

            There must be one, but of course lie by omission again.

          • joe

            And if you had half a brain, you would have asked me what type of Cancer I have so that you could check up on it but all you can spew out is— “lie by omission”– without any evidence, as usual, what a maroon.

          • AutismDadd

            If you had half a brain you would have said w/o me asking

          • joe

            “The cause of oligodendrogliomas is unknown” —that is from Wikipedia– that is what MY Cancer is called. Are you man enough to apologise for calling me a liar?

          • AutismDadd

            Unknown = lying by omission by the medical establishment

          • joe

            You implied I was lying, so you are not man enough to apologise?

          • AutismDadd

            What a jackass

          • joe

            You certainly are, ( jackass) you just can’t take it when you are caught out.

          • tomonthebay

            Adadd is much to little of a man to do that Joe.

          • joe

            He is no man, he has no morals, he has no integrity, and when beaten resorts to name calling equal to a four year old.

          • AutismDadd

            Name calling? As joe calls me a 4 year old…rich You owe me an apology

          • joe

            Did I hurt you widdle feelings pwecious, run along to mummy shewii give you your dummy.

          • AutismDadd

            just how old are you joe?

          • AutismDadd

            Oh wow, what an idiot

          • joe

            Yes you are.

          • AutismDadd

            I just don’t care.

          • TagMan

            Joe the Chinese believe ALL brain cancer comes from Stubbornness, refusing to change old patterns, mental frustration – often over the “perceived” stupidity of others??

          • joe

            Just goes to show how much the Chinese do not know.

          • TagMan

            Hey Joe – they were curing people at a level that Western medicine is only BEGINNING to understand – a thousand years ago. Technology has now proven the existence of the meridian system used in acupuncture – took us all this time just to prove they were right haha.

          • joe

            “Acupuncture” total woo.

          • sabelmouse

            or won’t admit it, or can’t bear to look at their own culpability. i constantly come across articles of ” omg, why this or that disease/condition, we must research more” .
            yeah, sure.

          • joe

            As usual you are wrong, NOBODY knows what causes my type of Cancer, if you had half a brain, which you don’t, your next question should have been is —“what type of Cancer do you have”?— I then would have told you and then YOU could have done your own research to see if I was lying—too late now.

          • sabelmouse

            i weren’t commenting on YOUR cancer in particular, but generally on the refusal of recognising how and why so many ”mystery” conditions/illnesses/diseases come about.
            aka huMAN made.
            but yes, they probably are [wilfully] blind to their own participation.

          • TagMan

            Joe I don’t believe you are lying about not knowing what caused your cancer – like I said – attitude might be a good place to start but cancer can come from food, the chemicals IN the food (higher probability), EMF, and a HOST of other things so i confirm – joe is not lying in this instance.

          • AutismDadd

            OMG they just don’t want to say anything. They want you to button your lip and take your treatment then leave.

          • TagMan

            I’d place bets on your attitude joe. According tothe Chinese, every disease that is not pathogen or injury related has an emotional background. Yep – attitude for sure.

          • jerry hamilton

            Largely caused by bad diet.
            Monsanto would also shove in their carcinogens by way of GMO pesticides. PROMOTED BY THE US GOV at a high cost to Monsanto.
            Go bang your head on the White House and tell them to take their glyphosate back.

          • jerry hamilton

            Hmmm…. Nonsense internet cures don’t.
            Some of those so called nonsense cures come from the greatest oncologists we have ever had.
            You dismiss them very easily but you have already pre decided.

          • tw0468
        • tw0468
      • thaddeusbuttmunchmd

        Nice spelling, Tameka. Do you know who your DADDY is??

      • tw0468
    • tw0468
  • Timothy Morrow

    I would not dismiss all the alternatives. I had cancer 13 years ago only given weeks to live, firstly i would warn everyone to question the doctors on why they recommend treatments. A hospital full of surgeons will only recommend the knife. My Cancer was in the bladder and the doctors said the only cure was the removal of the bladder. I had the tumor removed and radiotherapy after taking a second opinion. I also paid for an alternative therapy. Organic vegan diet with supplements, no stimulants like coffee, tea or booze. I became very fit walking 10 – 15 miles every day. My doctor told me i was silly talking to anyone else. Most doctors after 7 years training receive a couple of hours training on nutrition, and think about it your own doctor telling you getting fit is not a good idea

    • Ieva Zagante

      You have not told the stage (and staging can be mistaken), but how do you know that all that organic (if it was organic) vegan diet had any effect? Not boozing and active lifestyle are good for general health, but youu have no ways to prove they had any effect on your cancer. Let’s be clear: surgery+ radiation made it possible for you to get rid of all cancer.

  • rusty

    Cannabis oil can help you beat cancer but you have to change your diet as well, vegan organic foods no sugar, this would work better then those chemo/radio therapies. I no longer trust the gov/home office, treatments that work being used abroad are ignored by our government!

    • Matthew Brignall, ND

      I’ve worked as a physician with cancer patients for close to 20 years. If cannabis and diet changes cured cancer, I’d be dancing in the street, but they don’t. Fact is that when I talk to someone who believes these internet memes, I’m often talking to someone who will be dead in a few months, and that is devastatingly sad.

      • rusty

        Funny I say the same thing about cancer patients doing chemo! So why do hospitals give patients sweets or sugary morphin!? I also know people who’ve beaten cancer without chemo/radio therapy! Maybe there needs a large study involving cannabis and diets like organic vegan foods, I don’t think you have seen people using organic foods only no meats or dairy.

        • Matthew Brignall, ND

          You’ll not get any argument from me about whether the tools we currently have to treat cancer (and many other conditions) are flawed and underwhelming. Each wave of new treatments came with so much promise, then we quickly learn the limitations. This is a history lesson the CAM world often misses.
          I live and work in Seattle, an epicenter of the organics movement. If organic vegan food cures cancer, the Ornish trial at UCSF would have a vastly different result.

          • rusty

            Was cannabis being used with vegan foods? Was the doses correct what was the patients diets before/during and after treatments?

          • Matthew Brignall, ND

            This, in a nutshell, captures a critical problem with this democratization of cancer therapy idea – when it fails, and it generally does, it’s always the fault of the patient or the provider in charge of care.

          • rusty

            It’s no one’s fault if the die! I know cancer can be cured if protocols are followed, like type 2 diabetes, something doctors still say cut out white rice and bread when fats are the cause and vegan diet, minimise oils when cooking people get better.

          • thaddeusbuttmunchmd

            I would not want to be a cooked person-perhaps a “Baked” person due to Cannabis.

      • BJH

        Every MD, Biologist, Chemist and Researcher needs to watch and study the work of Dr. Raphael Mechoulam of the Hebrew University in Jerusalem, Israel. Watch this film about his research of cannabis and the endocannabinoid system. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=csbJnBKqwIw

        The National Cancer Institute acknowledged the anti-cancerous effects of cannabis. https://www.cancer.gov/about-cancer/treatment/cam/hp/cannabis-pdq

        You may also be interested in the research of Dr. Guillermo Velasco and Dr. Manuel Guzmán. They published research in 1998 that showed how tetrahydrocannabinol (THC) induces apoptosis in glioma cells. In 2011 they demonstrated THC even works with chemotherapy to kill brain cancer. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/9771884/
        https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/21220494/

        They’re raising money to conduct clinical human trials in Madrid, Spain. You can read more about Dr. Guzman here. http://cannabis-med.org/index.php?tpl=faq&red=faqlist&id=274&lng=en

        There is much more to this discussion, critical information that has seemed to escape the awareness of the author and many commentators.

        • Acleron

          Videos are not evidence.

          The NCI citation does not conclude any clinical effect of cannabinoids on cancer but there may be an effect on side effects caused by treatment. So no endorsement.

          The two references are not clinical studies but a) cell studies and b) cell studies + xenografts in mice.

          Wanting to do a clinical study and having any evidence is not having any evidence.

          Doesn’t look as if the author missed anything at all.

          • BJH

            Apparently you missed the mark as well. You’re building a straw man argument. I never stated that “videos are evidence.” I was encouraging persons of interest to familiarize themselves with the man who discovered the THC molecule, anandamides, and the endocannabinoid system.

            I’m fully aware of the fact that the two studies I shared are not human clinical studies. There are a number of animal models that are pretty compelling as well as countless anecdotal testimonies. Let’s remember that we’re considering a medicine that has been used for thousands of years and was once a standard medication prescribed by American doctors prior to prohibition. It is not as if this is anything new…modern scientific methods are only confirming what previous generations had already discovered. The U.S. Pharmacopeia classifies cannabis sativa/indica as medicine for the treatment of numerous ailements. http://antiquecannabisbook.com/Appendix/AppendixC.htm

            To date there have been thousands of studies both animal and human, demonstrating the efficacy of cannabis for treatment of everything from inflammatory disease to psychiatric issues.
            https://www.cannabis-med.org/data/pdf/2001-01-6.pdf

            I’m sorry that modern medical ED and pharmacology have deprived physicians from this previously well known and utilized medicine but ignorance doesn’t change the truth in the least bit.

            By the way I never claimed that cannabis cured cancer or that the studies I referenced were proof or evidence that cannabis kills cancer cells, despite the fact their are humdreds and dozens of correlative studies being conducted in China, Spain, Israel, the U.K. and the U.S. Stop with the straw men arguements and we may just have a productive dialogue.
            There is no excuse for not having a basic understanding of the endocannabinoid system. Peer reviewed studies have proven it’s existence and vital regulation of practically every bodily system. Here is a 1,000 page manuscript entitled “The Endocannabinoid System as an Emerging Target of Pharmacotherapy.” Read this before responding again. And please do watch the film (The Scientist) I posted. Cheers https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2241751/#!po=0.0449236

          • Acleron

            Still not interested in anything but evidence.

            This is what you wrote:-
            “The National Cancer Institute acknowledged the anti-cancerous effects of cannabis. ”
            They didn’t acknowledge it at all, so why write that if you are not claiming that cannibinoids are effective in treating cancer?

            Cell studies are difficult, they are slight indicators of an effect and often misleading.

            Arguments from antiquity get no traction except as marketing claims, blood letting was used for millennia as well.

            You don’t appear to quite understand the gulf between identifying a system as a pharmacological target and producing a drug with an adequate risk benefit ratio.

            It may be that a component of cannabis may be an effective drug but let’s have adequate evidence.

          • BJH

            You clearly did not read the material I provided nor the corresponding peer reviewed studies. The NCI did in fact acknowledge the anti-tumoral effects of cannabinoids. “Decreased incidences of benign tumors (polyps and adenomas) in other organs (mammary gland, uterus, pituitary, testis, and pancreas) were also noted in the rats. In another study, delta-9-THC, delta-8-THC, and cannabinol were found to inhibit the growth of Lewis lung adenocarcinoma cells in vitro and in vivo .[4] In addition, other tumors have been shown to be sensitive to cannabinoid-induced growth inhibition.[5-8]” “Cannabinoids appear to kill tumor cells but do not affect their nontransformed counterparts and may even protect them from cell death.” “Similar to findings in glioma cells, the cannabinoids were shown to trigger cell death through stimulation of an endoplasmic reticulum stress pathway that activates autophagy and promotes apoptosis.” “CBD may also enhance uptake of cytotoxic drugs into malignant cells. Activation of the transient receptor potential vanilloid type 2 (TRPV2) has been shown to inhibit proliferation of human glioblastoma multiforme cells and overcome resistance to the chemotherapy agent carmustine.”

            I can guarantee this, I’m am better informed on the endocannabinoid system and medicinal cannabis than you are. Their are 150 cannabinoids found within the plant which work synergistically. A certain level THCA is required for adequate Cannabinoid uptake. Isolating certain compounds from synergistic compounds will only continue to destroy it’s overall medicinal benefit and increase it’s toxicity. Our bodies were created to consume raw cannabis. It is the single most essential nutrient in the natural realm. Cannabinoid defeciency is one of the leading causes of all illness and disease.
            https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3044336/

            You can keep your mustard gas, cannabis is the future of medicine and especially cancer treatement.

            By the way, you have offered nothing substantial to back your opinions, and they’re truly nothing but opinions. You must be a Big Pharma shill or poorly educated on this subject.

          • Acleron

            You are now claiming that cannibinoids do treat cancers.

            But no extensive clinical studies, just as I said. The NCI does not endorse its use.

            What always amuses about claims such as this are comments about existing treatments which of course are just more marketing fodder and are irrelevant. However, its worth pointing out that if a treatment had such paucity of evidence as you put forward not only would the alt medders be complaining but qualified doctors and scientists too.

          • tw0468

            there will never be clinical trials because no pharmaceutical company will pay the exorbitant costs without the prospect of patent protection.
            therefore you will never have proof that satisfies you.

          • James Peters
          • Acleron

            No it is not promising but the disease states are complex and treating with a complex mixture of chemicals introduces many variables. So lots of wiggle room for people to carry on making claims.

            I must say that if I am ever unfortunate enough to be diagnosed with glioblastoma I would start smoking weed for it’s psychoactive effects providing it wasn’t contraindicated.

          • tw0468

            James, i would have thought that the they would be looking for a systemic response. is there any reason to believe that the thc placed in the cavity would be absorbed to trigger a ceremide release?

          • Acleron

            Read more of the comments, trials are already progressing, I’ll wait for the real evidence.

            If pharmaceutical companies thought there was sufficient activity they would modify the molecule to make a patentable product.

          • James Peters

            The antitumour effects are pretty modest and some of the preclinical studies found evidence that cannabinoids, under some circumstances, can actually stimulate cancer cell growth and contribute to tumour progression http://www.jimmunol.org/content/174/6/3281.long http://www.jimmunol.org/content/165/1/373.long http://cancerres.aacrjournals.org/content/64/6/1943.long http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0162310998000411 Furthermore, cancer cells can develop resistance https://www.nature.com/cdd/journal/v18/n6/full/cdd2010170a.html http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/wol1/doi/10.1002/glia.20856/full

          • tw0468

            thanks for the citations

          • Vladimir Stanescu

            If you are really interested in evidence (but you are not):
            http://jeffreydachmd.com/2014/06/cannabis-oil-acute-leukemia/
            All cancer patients who treat themselves with cannabis oil, including me, report a DOSE-DEPENDENT antitumoral effect (measurable by the markers), which excludes placebo, mental stuff and such (I don’t want to insult you, I suppose you know all that)

            And here is a study that shows how chemo kills patients 4 times faster than no treatment at all:
            http://www.drkelley.info/2015/06/17/chemotherapy-kills-cancer-patients-faster-than-no-treatment-at-all/

            It’s easier to be complacent and cash in the percentage from the chemo sales than show some guts and brains and demand some serious clinical studies

          • A retired radiologist and a dentist?
            Those are your cancer experts?
            Do either of them actually treat real patients with their snake oil or are they just internet doctors?
            Do they have any evidence any of their “alternative” nostrums actually work beside anecdotes (case studies)?

            Well, at least both of them have an online store just like all the other legitimate research scientists/physicians…

          • TagMan

            Hard to find more convincing proof than SEEING cancer cells destroyed by frequency – Royal Raymond Rife…

          • “What’s the frequency, Kenneth?” – as told by Dan Rather.
            https://www(dot)urbandictionary(dot)com/define(dot)php?term=What's the frequency, Kenneth?
            .
            Sorry TagMan, my taste in medical scammers/crackpots run in the Kevin Trudeau and Klee Irwin vein…
            https://rationalwiki(dot)org/wiki/Klee_Irwin
            .
            Royal Rife… Wooooooooo!!!!11!!!!!!1!! Woo-woo!

          • TagMan

            Reality.. all you are doing is showing how limited your brain is. Frequency can blow something as hard as a kidneystone into fragments that the kidneys can pass, it can take pictures of what is inside of you and even what is underground, it can SEND voice and pictures out into space… ALL of these things were on the “woo woo list” as you put it only a short time ago “Reality” – it can create light, it can even cook food but it’s not possible to blow up a cancer cell right mate… cos they’re somehow “special?” Har har… You appear to be one of those people who believe if you can’t see, hear, smell, or touch it – it doesn’t exist! And then you go on breathing anyway???

          • TagMan

            Are you REALLY that stupid “reality?” It staggers my mind that EVERY “woo woo” thing since electricity was discovered has been proven… light, telegraph, X-ray, Ct-Scans, ECG, electron microscopes, RADAR, radio, internet, computers, microwave ovens, ultra-sound – electricity can even kill YOU … it’s ENDLESS and yet you are STILL too stupid to contemplate that a cancer cell might be able to be negatively impacted by electricity too. I had NO idea there were people that stupid still living mate – who ties your shoelaces for you?

          • Acleron

            It should be obvious by now that the call for evidence is for studies reported in reputable peer reviewed journals, not anecdotes or opinion pieces and not cell or animal studies.

            If the evidence shows that a cannabis compound exhibits activity then providing it passes toxicology then doctors will use it.

            The trouble you are experiencing is that your arguments and your lack of evidence is exactly the same for every snake oil salesman.

            I’ve been demanding this evidence so telling me that I am being complacent is particularly ironic.

          • Vladimir Stanescu

            The charts and tests courtesy of the hospital are not anecdotical. Do you even read stuff or just trolling without having a clue ?
            It seems I have to repeat this: the snake oil does not work in a dose-dependant manner ! So cannabis oil it’s not placebo, not mental or anything, it’s a proper cure that works. Of course it does not work in 100% of the cases – only in 40-75%. But it’s far more than what the conventional killing system offers. And if you would have the guts and the brains to conduct some serious clinical studies, not the laughing stock you have done so far, it would make a lot of good. Cannabis oil worked for me and 2 of my friends. Not from the beginning, it’s trial and error to find the correct dose (there is a critical dose of about 1 ml pure oil per day; any less won’t work). Above the critical dose, my markers declined steadily until perfectly normal. One of my friends is also cancer free and the other is still in remission. Couldn’t care less if you believe me, I have no more time for this. The comments I read here reinforced my opinion about doctors and modern medicine, so…

          • Acleron

            Unverifiable data is anecdotal. When you’ve grown up and learned how to collect and report real results that can be checked and repeated, get back to us. In the meantime take the opportunity to spend 6 years just to get qualified for a career in clinical research and then a few more years to get the experience. If you could do that then you’d know what guts are, at the moment you have nothing.

          • Vladimir Stanescu

            guts – b. Informal. courage and fortitude; nerve; determination; stamina:
            It’s what you don’t have. It’s what you need to TRY to take SOME of the accounts seriously and petition to conduct REAL clinical studies. But you are happy with labeling all the accounts as anecdotical and not bothering with what doesn’t fit into your small world created in the medical school and tuned by experience. I am happy I have an engineering training and not a medical training. If I’d had taken the classical path, I’d be probably next to my mother and cousin now. They took that path and are “6 feet under” now. What do I have ? I have a non-detectable PSA score since 2012 (from 8, Gleason 7 3+4) a cancer free system (from T2C) and 2 friends, one cancer-free from Hodgkin and the other in remission from t3 pancreatic cancer.
            What do YOU have ? From all the cases and studies, can you show me enough conventional treated cancer-free patients after 5 years (over 3% , the “miraculously” cured, obviously) ? Can you show me 1 (one) conventionally treated patient with glioblastoma who SURVIVED 5 years ? I can show one who refused conventional and took RSO (anecdotical, of course). From what I noticed (I have a lot of friends and relatives in the medical field),
            few doctors are smart enough to try too look further, and fewer still those who know what works – and these very few have no intention to to tell what they know anytime soon.
            The rest (you included I presume) are just happy to go along with the “proved procedures”, although they proved to be very efficient in killing patients. And when the patient dies, you probably say “it was God’s will”, no ? I can’t imagine a worst kind of human being than a medical doctor who is religious – the perfect brainswashed trusty citizen.

          • Acleron

            It is you who needs the guts. The guts to spend long years learning how to understand evidence. The guts to accept that your claims are merely anecdotes and the guts to accept that if your claims are investigated in a clinical trial your claims may be wrong.

            So when you’ve done all this you might get a little respect for your views providing they are based on evidence and not anecdotes.

          • Vladimir Stanescu

            I gave you “anecdotes”, you gave me nothing except insults. If you can give me a mail address or something, I can send you the evolution of my markers. The tests are done at the same laboratory, monthly or at 2 months. The marker increased steadily. The only two periods of time when it decreased steadily, in a dose-dependant manner, was when I took RSO. It’s verifiable.

          • Acleron

            I repeated your own comments on guts. So not only have you presented zero verifiable evidence but you project as well, the insults came from you.

          • Vladimir Stanescu

            I hope you are not interested though, ‘cos in the actual legal context, I have nothing to gain and everything to lose by doing that. And judging by your comments…I mean maybe we should stick to anecdotical, doesn’t do me any harm.
            That was it. if you want to continue this stupidity. I hope you don’t. I will delete the address in 10 minutes.

          • Acleron

            Delete what you want, while you fail to provide evidence for your claims they will be just claims as likely as all sellers of nostrums.

          • Tara Dangora

            Hello, my nephew is battling grade 4 brain cancer. He’s 27 & already had 2 surgeries, radiation and chemo which isn’t working. He just started taking THC & CBD 50/50 oil from a dispensary here in Mass but I’m concerned that it’s not potent enough. I also can’t seem to convince him that he needs more THC than CBD to kill the cancer. Did your friend do anything other than the RSO? Any help you could provide would be greatly appreciated.

          • Vladimir Stanescu

            Hello. I am sorry to hear about your nephew. My friend was combining 13%THC 2%CBD RSO, 1mg/day (full extract, made the classic way, with ethanol), many supplements (reishi, astragalus, magnesium, etc) and a vegan diet. That’s all. Obviously, he was lucky. In my opinion, what your nephew is taking is potent enough. Also in my opinion, he should try some natural supplements for restoring the immune system. I try to be of some help by sharing my experience, but other than that…. I wish you and your nephew health and inspiration.

          • Karina .

            Hi, thank you for sharing all this info! How does one determine the combination and the dosage for a particular type of cancer?

          • By consulting an experienced, medically-qualified oncologist, and avoiding quacks.

          • Acleron

            The standard dosage appears to be whatever $50 gets you.

          • James Peters

            I’m sorry to hear this. Clinical trials could be of help https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/home https://app.emergingmed.com/cri/trials/

          • TagMan

            Tara – check out Rife. See my earlier posts. I was trained in nuclear, bacteriological, chemical and electronic warfare (electronics was my specialisation) and I can tell you – we could not find a level of radiation that did not warp living cells.

          • TagMan

            The problem Vladimir, is that the medical colleges are owned or funded by the pharmaceutical companies so guess what the student doctors are taught… you GOT it – “there’s a PILL for EVERYTHING!!!”

          • Barzini

            LOL

          • Barzini

            Thanks for your posts – the other guy is a troll, his job is to dissuade people from getting healthy

          • Acleron

            Try producing the evidence. Until you have such evidence you have no idea what can cure disease. Baseless accusations are not evidence of anything.

          • Barzini

            Peer reviewed science journals are a pathetic joke, no one believes that garbage anymore

            I have no interest in collecting evidence or presenting it, anyone who discovered a cheap cure to cancer would be destroyed or even killed

            On you go troll…..

          • Acleron

            You have no evidence, just claims and and ludicrous stories. Fortunately, people who are far more responsible than you, are investigating the activity of cannabis so we will learn what is happening.

          • Barzini

            Lol

            All cheap and effective methods of tackling cancer are being ruthlessly suppressed – as they always have been

            You are part of one of the vilest and most evil industries on the planet – and one day you will have to meet your maker and explain your actions – baby killer

            Hope it works out for you baby killer

          • Acleron

            In the absence of evidence the antivaxxer incoherently mutters insults.

          • TagMan

            OMG – you just blew your cover Acleron – I should have guessed that you are pro-vaccination too. And for all your BS re “peer reviewed” garbage – there has never BEEN a review that proved that vaccination works. In fact, while the CONCEPT of vaccination makes sense, the reality is – you can’t trust what is IN them. I’d just LOVE to hear you tell how putting not one but TWO neurotoxins DIRECTLY into the blood, will not result in a neurological disease – ADHD, ADD, Aspergers, dementia, alzheimers, Parkinsons… the list goes on. And why is it that the Amish (who don’t vaccinate) have ADD, ADHD, and Autism rates at the same levels they were a hundred years ago (one in THOUSANDS), as compared to the 1 in 50 of the vaccinated members of society. OMG – thanks for the entertainment though – go get your “shots” mate – you’ll live forever har har.

          • Acleron

            What cover?

            The evidence that vaccination works is overwhelming, only idiots deny it.

            Before you make even more a fool of yourself, learn something about dose responses, in fact from the tenor of your posts, get an education.

            That education might include that the Amish do vaccinate and they do have autism.

          • TagMan

            Har har baby – I am an electronic scientist trained in electronic warfare and in order to learn how to kill people with electronics, you have to understand something of the biology of the body so your belief in my not having an education is as erroneous as your beliefs mate, You’re a pussy of the pharma companies and good luck to you – you’ll need it.

          • Acleron

            Being corrected on facts you have to go for the man not the argument.

            Having slightly more knowledge than yourself I see when pharmaceutical companies behave despicably and heartily criticise them for it. That doesn’t translate to the silly beliefs you have in vaccines.

            It also appears I’m a lot more compassionate to all others than you. After all, I’ve never worked to deliberately harm others, unlike you.

          • disqus_1yb8x39w7X

            Says the shill who’s PRO VAX attitude has KILLED MILLIONS

          • Acleron

            Oh, an idiot. Your evidence that I receive money from a pharmaceutical company? No evidence? That makes you a liar then

            Name a product I have supported that kills dozens, let alone millions, with evidence that it causes wholesale death. Come on bigmouth. You claimed it so own it.

          • disqus_1yb8x39w7X

            Oh another lying arse shill… here we go again lol SHOW ME YOUR EVIDENCE Lmao

          • Acleron

            So, as usual, you have no evidence for your accusation. Just a lying antivaxxer.

          • TagMan

            Just look up vaccination mate. HUNDRES – probably THOUSANDS of girls killed or maimed by gardasil alone – another one in the news today. One of the most beautiful young girls I ever knew – daughter of a friend, lit the room just by her presence and within three days of getting the multiple vaccination at age 7 she was a vegetable. She was supposed to die with a week or so but her mum and dad wouldn’t let it happen mate and 35 years later, they still have to feed and bathe her and take her to the toilet. Worse than ANY of the diseases she was being vaciinated for and you PROMOTE that shit. You should be abjectly ASHAMED of yourself!

          • Acleron

            So you have no evidence, pathetic.

          • TagMan

            Evidence of what exactly acleberry? Go on line and you’ll find THOUSANDS of cases like the one that was in the news just the other day. Gardasil has killed or maimed more girls than any vaccination in history yet mothers are STILL being persuaded to give it to their daughters! Well the world’s population NEEDS to be reduced (and as Bill Gates said – vaccination is the best way to do it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4vzFeiKH1jQ) so best that the stupid go first I guess. I feel for the daughter though – what a Mum she has!!

          • Acleron

            So, like all the antivaxxers, you have zero evidence. You obviously have no idea of what constitutes scientific evidence or the necessity for controls. Also, rather obviously, you are not a scientist. What was it you did, trainee electronics technician at most?

          • TagMan

            ackie – you are the classic armchair warrior – big and brave with your fingers on a keyboard but probably shit your pants if a mouse squeaks behind you. I’m struggling to believe anyone could REALLY be as stupid as you and walk and breathe at the same time. So that means you are simply a shit stirrer and THAT you are really good at. Congratulations mate – professional shit stirrer – it suits you perfectly.

          • Acleron

            So, as usual, you have no evidence for your claims just puerile insults.

          • JoeFarmer

            Pathetic. Delete your account.

          • disqus_1yb8x39w7X

            Ooohhh look a shill bashing LOL You are the pathetic ones with not an ounce of Truth amongst you. Sad,

          • JoeFarmer

            You have successfully demonstrated that you’re delusional. Congratulations.

          • disqus_1yb8x39w7X

          • JoeFarmer

            You’re not very good at this. Time to add failed internet troll to your resume.

          • TagMan

            DISQUS is delusional???? He couldn’t match you guys for delusion if he TRIED joe.

          • JoeFarmer

            You’re not very good at this. Time to add failed internet troll to your resume.

          • TagMan

            Oh you’re a gem Ackyboy – and more knowledgable that any man that has ever walked before you – a legend in your own nose-picking time. I bow down to you (mostly so you can’t see the tears STREAMING down my face from laughing har har). It’s regrettable that yes – i was first engaged in learning how to do harm to people but that same knowledge gained there has enabled me to save or improve the lives of over a hundred people in the last 11 years. There is no money that can buy the joy of seeing hope come back into a person’s life Acles – how many people have YOU saved?

          • Acleron

            You sell Rife machines, a well known fraud. Who can trust the claims of a fraudster?

          • TagMan

            Yeah… well – with the intelligence of a tadpole Ackkybaby, i don’t expect you to even BEGIN to understand Rife. The medical “profession” wouldn’t EXIST as we know it, without electronics. It can heat and even COOK, it can take pictures of what is going on inside the body, it can monitor, it can control, it can blow even KIDNEY-STONES into little fragments but hell NO – cancer cells are “SPECIAL” aren’t they acleberry – no WAY that electronics could POSSIBLY impact a cancer cell. You are SO dumb and/or STUPID that it’s hardly worth the amusement of communicating with you. You should talk to the EIGHTY ONE PERCENT of people who have come to me over the last eleven years – told by that “profession” that you believe SO blindly in that they had one to six months to live, and have now been shown to be free of cancer after being treated by me. But it’s ok mate – as long as that level of abject stupidity doesn’t hurt – I’m happy for you.

          • Acleron

            I would be abjectly stupid to believe any of your claims. I have had to design and build my own instruments so I also know how simplistic is the Rife scam.

            Throwing in sciency terms such as frequency may impress the people you scam, it doesn’t impress me.

          • TagMan

            That’s because you don’t have the capacity to understand it acles! The only thing that impresses me is that you (hopefully) walk upright?

          • Acleron

            I don’t understand a simple scam? Are you kidding?

          • TagMan

            See what I mean? Avoiding the question AGAIN!! I asked “how many people have YOU saved accles and all you could do was cuss me out. You’re not an advisor to turdeau are you ?

          • Acleron

            As you are making the claims then it is you who answer questions.

            You have helped zero people while you were defrauding them. Selling them a worthless box while muttering incoherently about frequency has, according to you, convinced over 100 people to hand over money to you for nothing. You are just a despicable fraud preying on the vulnerable. The lowest of the low.

          • TagMan

            Was amused to come back to this post of yours acles “Being corrected on facts you have to go for the man not the argument.”
            Talk about the pot calling the kettle black eh mate. And MAN I’ll bet those pharmaceutical companies shape up after the mighty ACCLES has “heartily criticised them” har har har.

            Hope you gave them good rounding up over gardasil mate – not sure if they gave a shit though cos I see theyre trying to push it on BOYS now. WOW!

          • disqus_1yb8x39w7X

            Only idiots deny it ? LOL @ the shill

          • Acleron

            You’ve splattered your idiocy all over this forum, so yeah, idiots.

            Just like to point out you’ve lied again, if you cannot produce anything except silly lies you are worthless.

          • disqus_1yb8x39w7X

            “You’ve splattered your idiocy all over this forum, so yeah, idiots.

            Just like to point out you’ve lied again, if you cannot produce anything except silly lies you are worthless.”

          • Acleron

            And when caught in the crossfire all you can do is parrot somebody else’s comment.

            So not only a liar but pathetic as well.

            Having being caught out in your shill gambit, one could hope you would stop. However, you won’t and I’ll just have to embarrass you again by pointing out you have no evidence for your false accusations.

          • TagMan

            Overwhelming? Acky baby – disease is CYCLIC and most vaccinations are brought out when the disease is already on it’s way out, and then it’s claimed that ‘vaccination” did the trick. WOOHOO!! Did you notice that when the measles episode burst out in California recently they POUNCED on the “outbreak” to slam all those none vaccinated people and… oops NINETY TWO PERCENT of them were up to date. You are talking TOTAL shit when you say vaccination has been “proven,” and the side effects of vaccination are often worse than the disease they were supposed to “protect” you from. Look at the number of girls around the world who have been killed or MAIMED by Gardasil! But as a “responsible parent” you would have that shit shoved into YOUR daughter’s arm ANYWAY wouldn’t you mate. When H1N1 came out it was projected that 17,000 people would die in Australia because there was no vaccine available. End of season…SEVENTEEN people had died – the lowest number of deaths to flu in 20 years and the FIRST year they didn’t have a vaccine… (Double) Oops!!

          • Acleron

            So if 92% were vaccinated in the California outbreak and the vaccine is not effective then 92% of those infected would be vaccinated, so what actually happened? 45% were unvaccinated, a further 43% had unknown vaccination status. That makes MMR a very effective vaccine. Of those unvaccinated several had claimed religious or personal exemptions. They had obviously been influenced by idiots who lie a lot.

            https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm6406a5.htm

            You will of course have references to evidence for the rest of your claims, won’t you?

          • TagMan

            In view of the information I have both from my job, my research and my experience acles – I feel no need to go looking for this stuff. When it comes to me – usually via the news, i read and dispose. You belong to a cult – the “medicine is the ONLY “cure” cult, and only the most powerful anti-brainwashing techniques could HOPE to help you. So go get your shots baby and please leave us to do the right thing. I’m sorry but I am not here to research for you and to ascertain what information is “right or wrong” – like the bumblebee that “science” says should not be able to fly (but he keeps on flying anyway) – I’ll just keep on HEALING people – even though you and mr “farmer” and the karins of the world don’t believe it is possible. A bunch of sad little puppies but hey… there’s probably a “shot” for that too – look it up!

          • Acleron

            So no references, no answers to the contradiction in your ideas and a quack to boot. You’ve never cured anybody but you’ve made enough money from your useless electronic gimmicks. How much do you sell $5 worth of components for? Ah, nearly $1200, a profitable scam.
            https://www.resonantlight.com/products/

          • JoeFarmer

            Wow, what a pile of nonsense! I’m surprised Canada Health hasn’t gone after those crooks.

          • Acleron

            They have the weasel words of all these scammers.

            ‘The information on, or linked from, resonantlight.com should not be construed as medical advice. The information and products are provided for educational and research purposes only, and by using this website, you accept all responsibility for any actions you may take. No claims for any purpose are stated or implied, and Resonant Light Technology Inc. is in no way responsible for the information supplied or use of the products for anything beyond responsible research.’

            Then they have testimonials. These anecdotes are all they have.

            Sheesh, I bought a frequency generator recently with a range from 10 to 100,000 Hertz. It cost £15. These scammers are shameless and just as guilty of price gouging as pharmaceutical companies.

          • TagMan

            Joe – you are DISGUSTING! So you would have health Canada deny people the RIGHT to choose their OWN methods for treating their OWN bodies? And like I said… people typically come to me when all hope has been removed – they have been given 1-6 months to live by your infallable medical “profession” and it is not until the HOSPITAL tells them the cancer is gone that I stop treatment! So the 81% that are now free of cancer in SPITE of what they were told – you in your UNBELIEVABLE arrogance would have denied the opportunity? And Joe – you “holier than thou” piece of shit… I DON’T CHARGE!!! If they want to leave a donation I gratefully accept that but I DON’T CHARGE! I hope you are gifted with the learning of receviing cancer and all that goes with it Joe – that is the scum level that you are!

          • JoeFarmer

            You should be prosecuted for fraud. Plain and simple. GFY and DIAF.

          • Ron Roy

            Do you eat with that mouth? Your reactions to losing a discussion are like that of an undisciplined little child. And Gold upvoting your behavior is also deplorable.

          • JoeFarmer

            I haven’t lost any discussion, moron. You should have a grown-up read and explain it to you.

          • AutismDadd

            That didn’t come from his mouth

          • TagMan

            And how exactly am I committing “fraud” sweetie when 81% of my CANCER clients (not counting other people that i treat) would GLADLY stand in court and tell the court that I had saved them? Wouldn’t look good for your ‘peer reviewed shit” when every ONE of them had been kicked out the door by your “convential medics, ” PRIOR to coming to me and getting a resutl. Just because you don’t understand something joeybaby – doesn’t mean it doesn’t work? I’m betting you don’t understand a damn thing about jet engines either but you still get on a plane don’t you? You HAVE to believe in evolution because people are becoming more stupid by the DAY it seems.

          • JoeFarmer

            You need to be prosecuted for fraud.

          • Gold

            Joe – you are DISGUSTING! So you would have health Canada deny people the RIGHT to choose their OWN methods for treating their OWN bodies?

            Let’s flip that on it’s head and look at it from a rational position; What I’m actually hearing here is @disqus_hV3WNN3Edw:disqus arguing for the right to push any unfounded and unproven product upon an unsuspecting population.

            It’s not about freedom of choice. It’s about public safety and protection from charlatans.

            If there was anything to that product you would be pushing all of the data and research at us rather than falling back to “freedom of choice”.

            I’m with @disqus_Cr8yNogHAJ:disqus, if you’re pushing that your a con artist praying on people’s ignorance.

            Of course, you could change my position on this just by presenting the robust research that has been done on this that shows the application you have here is a valid outcome of that research.

          • TagMan

            Another full of shit dumbass “gold.” You guys turn things around to have NOTHING TO DO with what was said and then expect others to believe what YOU say? “Pushing an unfounded and unproven product??” REALLY? How do you come to that glorious perception when i have NO website, I INSIST that people who want to learn more come for a FREE (that word isn’t too big for you is it “gold”) a FREE sesssion then go away and THINK about it and IF, they feel it has helped in any way THEN we can discuss where they would LIKE to go from there. AND… if they have no money (which many DON’T having lost all their savings on “peer reviewed treatments” that HAVEN’T WORKED) they DON’T PAY ME. Otherwise it is DONATION ONLY. So tell me how I am being this “snake oil salesman” that you love to accuse me of being and tell me how 81% of the people who were TOLD THEY WERE GOING TO DIE after your “peer reviewed treatments FAILED, have now been CLEARED BY THE VERY HOSPITALS that gave them no hope of life? Can you see why you and your cronies DISGUST me to the level that you do “gold?” And seeing as you see yourself as SO much better of a human being than i am – tell me – what have YOU done for FREE to help other people!

          • TagMan

            Ahh.. only one problem here “gold” – I don’t “PUSH” ANYTHING! I don’t have a website, I don’t advertise – people ONLY come to me by word of mouth and in my experience, people don’t recommend people to those who “push,” ESPECIALLY if what they are “pushing” doesn’t WORK! Weird huh? And “robust evidence?” OMG – if a bumblebee stung you between the cheeks would THAT evidence be “robust” enough for you to believe that bumblebees can sting mate? Or would you want the evidence of a “peer reviewed clinical trial” before you made sure you didn’t sit on another one. Yeah – don’t answer the question I know – you’d sit on another one har har.

          • AutismDadd

            And you thoughts on VIOXX and the behavior of its maker MERCK is what?

          • shay simmons

            Joe – you are DISGUSTING! So you would have health Canada deny people the RIGHT to choose their OWN methods for treating their OWN bodies?

            Ask Ezekiel Collet how well that worked out when his parents chose their own method for treating his meningitis.

          • TagMan

            That is NOT what i am talking about and you bloody KNOW it. They were TOTAL idiots and deserve whatever comes to them. Shay I do NOT diagnose people – I STRONGLY sugges that they be diagnosed by the medial profession and continue to WORK with the medical profession to the degree that they can while undergoing any treatment offered by me. Why are you people so AFRAID of the possibility of people out there like me who DON’T rip people off and actually DO get success with treatments that WORK but have been given the financial stamp of “orthodox medicine?”

          • shay simmons

            “This is NOT what I’m talking about ”

            You may not realize it, or you may be unwilling to admit it, but yes…this is what you are talking about.

          • TagMan

            Nope – it’s what you WANT me to be talking about mate, and you will twist anything and everything i say to fit your pathetically dim little world.

          • shay simmons

            Sorry, “mate” – Collet’s parents were advised by an RN and a homeopath to take him to the hospital. They continued to pursue altmed until he was beyond saving.

            People who peddle junk cures – like yours – give permission to parents to ignore evidence-based medicine and go with what they “feel” is in the best interests of their children.

          • Gold

            That site would be illegal in New Zealand. Does the ASA equivalent in Canada allow for testimonials to be used to advertise medical and health related claims?

          • JoeFarmer

            Good question. I’m in the U.S., so I don’t know. I think Flabberghasted is Canadian, I bet she would know.

          • TagMan

            You’re from NEW ZEALAND “gold?” OMG so what do you say about that NZ farmer being cured by hi dose vitamnin C injections after chemo failed AGAIN. High dose is “un-reviewed” mate so I guess it must have been his imagination right. Go and play with your sheep mate – they’re the only “peers” you will ever have!

          • Ron Roy

            Canada Health tried to suppress Gaston Naessens cancer cure 714X by taking him to court and they lost both times. There were so many people, that were helped by his compound in court, that the government didn’t dare rule against him.

          • JoeFarmer

            If it were a cure, there would be evidence. Another brainless post by Ron Roy.

          • Acleron

            It is typical quackery, a somatoscope that detects a form of life in cells that nobody else had ever noticed. A treatment named after himself consisting of camphor and some salts injected straight into the bloodstream. Complete fruitloopery.

          • JoeFarmer

            Ordinary quackery is bad enough, but these charlatans that take advantage of desperate cancer patients are especially reprehensible and disgusting.

          • TagMan

            ESPECIALLY when it actually HELPS them. Can’t have THAT eh joey?? Har har.

          • JoeFarmer

            You should be prosecuted for fraud.

          • TagMan

            And YOU should be prosecuted for walking around without a brain mate. If you were ever ON a NZ farm – your brain got warped by the cow poop mate. You’re an embarrassment to those farmers that actually have brains.. Like acleron the academic… You are so far up yourself it’s a wonder you can breathe and shove THIS in your judgement pouch dickhead…
            1. The first session is ALWAYS free – after which I ask the person to go away and think about whether or not they felt it had helped – THEN come back, if they want to either get further treatment or to buy their own machine (which I buy from the US and support FREE for as long as they need help by the way).
            2. I have an analyser that scans the WHOLE BODY with over 270 tests and after 7-10 treatments we run the analysis again to see if anything has changed, AND
            3. Payment is by DONATION ONLY, and I have treated MANY people who have been bankrupted by your revered medical system – FOR FREE.
            So OH “BRILLIANT ONE… tell me how that equates to a scam or a ripoff in your enlightened view, and ESPECIALLY, how is it that so many people have been cleared BY THE VERY HOSPITALS THAT GAVE THEM 1-6 MONTHS TO LIVE, after having been treated by ME-?. I would LOVE to know what YOU have done EVER, to help even a QUARTER of the people I have, See how “assuming” truly DOES make an ass out of people?
            You two are shit stirrers plain and simple – only two lobes to either brain – one’s lost an the other is out looking for it. WOW!!!

          • JoeFarmer

            You are a charlatan and a fraud and you should be prosecuted and sent to prison.

          • TagMan

            Oops – the record is broken – it keeps repeating itself!!

          • TagMan

            Exactly Ron – you should be ashamed of yourself! People continuing to walk around after the medicos told them they were going to die is NOT evidence mate. For people like JoeLosttheFarm, even having one of them come and punch his stupid head in wouldn’t be “evidence” har har. Buck up mate!

          • JoeFarmer

            So you can’t provide any evidence, either. What a surprise!

          • TagMan

            joebaby – there isn’t enough evidence in the WORLD to get through that thick skull of yours mate. It just wouldn’t worth the EFFORT!

          • JoeFarmer

            It took you 3 days to come up with that? LMAO!

            Try having a grownup help you next time.

          • TagMan

            Same thing happened in Australia with Dr. Holt using Rife. The people would ALLOW them to shut him down because he was too successful!

          • TagMan

            I don’t manufacture the machines acles – i buy them from a reputable manufacturer in the US. What fascinates me though is how you stand in denial when the ultimate proof of Rife’s discovery is the VISIBLE destruction of cancer cells under a microscope? And why do you think there are front page news articles STILL on the internet with the top medical “professionals” of the time lining up to get their photographs taken with him and giving him accolades for the number of peole he had cured of cancer?

          • Acleron

            So you are impressed by what you think is authority. I’m impressed by evidence. It is dead easy to kill cells on a microscope slide, the difficult part is keeping the little beggars alive.

            You buy them? So, stupid as well as a fraudster. 15 yos are building more complex machines than yours.

          • TagMan

            Oh don’t be so bloody stupid ackky baby. That statement is so stupid it doesn’t warrant any further response.

          • Acleron

            So why did you?

            You have no idea of cell culture and it looks like little idea of electronics. In fact you are just a fraud.

          • TagMan

            You and your equally deficient cronies need a little education accie… fraud – “wrongful or criminal deception intended to result in financial or personal gain.” I don’t deceive ANYONE – if you asked all of the people including in business to say one thing about me – I guarantee that one thing would be – he is completely honest and trustworthy, I don’t gain a damn THING financially from treating people, and the only PERSONAL gain is the satisfaction of seeing their lights come back on. So there you go WRONG again – surprise surprise…

          • Acleron

            We already know you are a liar, you sell those worthless machines and help no-one.

            Yes, I’m aware of the definition of fraud and you fit it to a tee.

          • TagMan

            You are SUCH a judgemental DICK acleron. Your pissy little unit that you built – what was the frequency range? Was it digital or analogue? Why did you choose whatever your choice was? Did you run direct frequency or did you run RF – what decided your choice? Was the gate rate variable or fixed? Why? Could you adjust the duty cycle or was that fixed? Why? Were your frequencies crystal or otherwise controlled? What temperature compensation did you use to hold frequencies accurate? Did you go for direct contact or plasma tubes? What decided your choice? What was the output power??? Your little piece of garbage probably couldn’t do ANY of that mate could it? And you wouldn’t have a CLUE as to if or why any of that was important.
            You are so far up yourself it’s a wonder you can breathe and shove THIS in your judgement pouch dickhead…
            1. The first session is ALWAYS free – after which I ask the person to go away and think about whether or not they felt it had helped – THEN come back, if they want to either get further treatment or to buy their own machine (which I buy from the US and support FREE for as long as they need help by the way).
            2. I have an analyser that scans the WHOLE BODY with over 270 tests and after 7-10 treatments we run the analysis again to see if anything has changed, AND
            3. Payment is by DONATION ONLY, and I have treated MANY people who have been bankrupted by your revered medical system – FOR FREE.
            So OH “BRILLIANT ONE… tell me how that equates to a scam or a ripoff in your enlightened view, and ESPECIALLY, how is it that so many people have been cleared BY THE VERY HOSPITALS THAT GAVE THEM 1-6 MONTHS TO LIVE, after having been treated by ME-?. I would LOVE to know what YOU have done EVER, to help even a QUARTER of the people I have, See how “assuming” truly DOES make an ass out of people?

          • Acleron

            My instruments were not designed with the stupidity of Rife.

            So you run a scam with a loss leader.

            You’ve already admitted you sell these machines. Low intelligent scammers nearly always forget their lies.

            An instrument that scans the whole body? Hilarious.

          • TagMan

            OMG – it’s almost worth coming back just to see how much more stupid you can get acciebaby! WOW so you are even smarter than the guy who designed the first microscope able to see a living cell? So what have you designed in YOUR imagined brilliance accie? The mind BOGGLES – I wait in bated anticipation!!

            Accie you REALLY need to step back and do some reflection…
            You slag other people for slagging other people and yet you are up there with the best.

            You NEVER answer even the most LEGITIMATE questions (probably because you can’t).

            You accuse people of things that are inherently incorrect – you just make it up as you go

            You obviously don’t have the intellect to be able to understand the simple logic for example of the FACT that if you can blow a kidneystone up with frequency you can SURELY do the same to a pissy (by comparison) little cancer cell.

            And you can’t even read and understand a simple post here let-alone any of these “complex documents” that you purport to read.

            For example – you accuse me of lying about selling machines? Show me where I said I “give them away.” Being humane enough to give free treatments where people don’t have any money left doesn’t mean I can afford to give machines away for free that I have had to pay for – I’m not QUITE as stupid as you.

            And what would be the “gain” in running a “scam” that loses money accles? Are you COMPLETELY stupid?

            Ahh “a machine that scans the whole body – hlarious” – REALLY accles? Uhmm – isn’t that what a CT scan does? Isn’t that what MRI does? X-ray can do it, Ultra-sound can do it. And then you have EEG, AND ECG.. which century did you say you are from mate?

            No you in particular, along with your crap stirring cronies here who wouldn’t know your arses from a hole in the ground, are the scum of the earth, in fulfilling your part of the minefield that people have to go through to find something that might actually help when the medical “profession” has failed them – even AFTER all of your “peer reviewed cures.” Well you can play your games here and get away with it acleron but wait till you leave this world – you are going to find yourself in a place that you TOTALLY have earned. Shame upon ALL of you.

          • TagMan

            Accie baby you are behaving like a petulant little puppy and further displaying your COMPLETE stupidity. “You have never cured anyone…” I never said I HAD. I said (coincidentally of course) after treatment, EIGHTY ONE PERCENT baby – read that again EIGHTY ONE PERCENT of the people I have treated have been told by the VERY HOSPITALS THAT TOLD THEM THEY WERE GOING TO DIE – that they no longer have cancer. You’re what is called a “selective reader accie and to explain what that means (seeing as you would never figure it out on your own) it means that you read only the bits that you can twist to mean something that was never intended by the writer mate.

          • Acleron

            Yeah, yeah, more claims and zero evidence.

          • Mike Stevens

            Is that his website?

          • Acleron

            I’ve no idea, it was chosen as representative of the prices charged for worthless machines.

          • tomonthebay

            So you are just making it up. Glad you clarified that.

          • Mike Stevens

            “Did you notice that when the measles episode burst out in California recently they POUNCED on the “outbreak” to slam all those none vaccinated people and… oops NINETY TWO PERCENT of them were up to date.”

            Where do you source your lies from?
            Facts are that of the 110 California residents affected, the vaccination status was only known/determined for 61 cases.
            Of those cases, only 9 were fully vaccinated or had serological evidence of vaccination. Doing the math, that is 15%.
            85% were unvaccinated or incompletely vaccinated.

            https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm6406a5.htm

            “Among the 110 California patients, 49 (45%) were unvaccinated; five (5%) had 1 dose of measles-containing vaccine, seven (6%) had 2 doses, one (1%) had 3 doses, 47 (43%) had unknown or undocumented vaccination status, and one (1%) had immunoglobulin G seropositivity documented, which indicates prior vaccination or measles infection at an undetermined time.”

          • Verna Lang

            And everyone seems to forget that the Disney measles became a souvenir brought home to Canada. Most of the affected were part of a religious community that did not believe in vaccinations.
            “In Quebec, a total of 158 cases of the same genotype (B3) were reported in a non-immunizing religious community by March 28, and the importation to Canada was linked to travel to Disneyland.
            That event show just how well measles can travel and spread in the unvaxxed.

          • Acleron

            And while the unvaxxed are transporting it about, it endangers everyone, especially those who cannot be vaccinated.

            I can understand the mindset of those who cannot understand science and feel that events are beyond their control and react against. I cannot understand the mindset of those who are presented with the undeniable evidence from Disneyland, Italy, Minnesota, Romania, Spain, UK, Germany etc that measles is very dangerous and vaccines are safe and effective and then carry on promoting their lies.

            What do they get out of it? Are they so bereft of societal pleasure they need the strokes of others equally lacking. Do they get an insane pleasure from the suffering of others?

            Sure, some make money on the back of antivaxxer lies but I’m sorry but in general I can’t understand their motivation.

          • TagMan

            Been researching vaccination since 1960 when my best friend’s older sister GOT polio from the very vaccination that was supposed to make her immune dunghole! Also learned more that you could even IMAGINE (although you do seem to have a pretty good imagination Acle) about the dark side of vaccination in the biological warfare dept. But you’re doing an AWESOME job of upholding the faith in your poison mate – heopefully one day YOU will experience the damage that so MANY around the world have incurred. But vaccination is your religion and faith – however unfounded, is incredible!

          • Acleron

            What would someone working in electronic warfare know about CBW? About as much as you know about vaccines.

            Working in immunology it was my job to know about vaccines, to assess clinical trials and design them. So far you have shown you know nothing about maths, biology or medicine. I suspect your only skill is separating the gullible from their money.

          • TagMan

            Sigghh – LOGIC accles that word that you struggle so hugely with… in order to KILL something with electronics – you have to understand the BIOLOGY of it. Jeez mate – get some oxygen – your brain is in total deprivation!

          • JoeFarmer

            You are really, really bad at this.

          • TagMan

            Oops – it’s the broken record again…

          • JoeFarmer

            Yawn…

          • Ron Roy

            ”The evidence that vaccination works” You mean works at creating more patients / customers for the MEDICAL MAFIA.

          • Acleron

            Your silly phrase has already been debunked and you had no comprehensible reply.

            However RonRon has a phrase that is alliterative, repetitive and in capitals. Ooh RonRon that must make it true, to you. There are faults with the pharmaceutical industry and questioning politicians and the industry on those faults would eventually give you a useful job, unfortunately lackwits like you and your mates are incapable.

          • TagMan

            You are SO good on the accusations ackky but in going back i find that you haven’t addressed a SINGLE question put to you – NOT ONE – you just continue to spout your shit over and over. AWESOME!!

          • Acleron

            You obviously don’t read very well.

          • TagMan

            Oh I read VERY well mate – I’m even a published AUTHOR – are you able to name ONE useful thing you’ve done in YOUR life accles?

          • Acleron

            ‘I’m even a published AUTHOR’

            Ha,ha.
            Ha,ha,ha.

          • shay simmons

            You are evidently laboring under the delusion that putting something in all caps makes it true.

          • AutismDadd

            Lets have your Amish studies showing they have children with autism from vaccination

          • shay simmons
          • Renè

            Acleron is investigating the effects of Bud Light and crystal meth right now.

          • Acleron

            How do we know when Rene is lying? When he posts.

          • TagMan

            In 2016 FIFTEEN doctors in the US died (“accidentally” of course) – ALL of whom were working on cancer cures….

          • chiz

            SO MUCH BULL/// CAN U GIVE US ANY PROOF THAT THE BEST MODEREN MEDICINE SAVE LIFE ?

          • Acleron

            Lol, a new troll. Go away and learn some manners, child.

          • disqus_1yb8x39w7X

            Of course he can he’s a big pharma shill – Lying is what they do best.
            I am Gobsmacked at the shilling going on here ! CBD/THC oil cures cancer that is a FACT I have seen NUMEROUS people cured this way and not just cancer is great for all sorts of things…. Its Magic ! Of course big pharma shills will not allow me to DARE speak such truths in trying to heal our failing population – Oh No I will be called a liar yet have seen with my own eyes the evidence shills demand but they don’t want evidence Whatever you provide will never be enough EVER you are fighting a losing battle the minute you converse with a shill Remember how they demonised laetrile/amygdalin/B17 ? as a cure for cancer Yep same old line repeated here… Over and over again…… We are Forbidden to cure ourselves. Please Wake Up.

          • TagMan

            Yeah but mate… haven’t you got the gist yet? It doesn’t MATTER if 10,000 people have miraculously recovered from a particular therapy – unless it has been (questionably) “peer reviewed” in a laboratory – it can’t possibly be true har har.

          • disqus_1yb8x39w7X

            Mate – I got the gist a long time ago…..

          • TagMan

            disqus I have to tell you that i am SO opposed to drugs of any kind that I would struggle HUGELY to try marijuana for anything personally, BUT… another scientist in my town (a good friend) who was EQUALLY against it is working in a laboratory here and he says they are SEEING the results, So i support you 100% over those miracle “vaccines” that are the flavour for the less intelligent here. It’s in places like this that you realise the void between intellect and intelligence – it’s HUGE!

          • TagMan

            Chiz it is not INTENDED to “save life” – it is intended to PROLONG it. You don’t make money from healthy people – get with the program mate!

          • Vladimir Stanescu

            Thank you.

          • omfgwtfbbq

            Maybe if it wasn’t classified as schedule 1 you’d have them. The clinical trials are just starting. There are only 1 or 2 clinical trials up to this point and all of those clinical trials use singular chemical extracts and not the whole plant extract (which will contain 100s of cannabinoids). You may need clinical studies to believe it yourself. But, while the pharmacology is being worked up and all of these 100 compounds are going through pre-clinical work — people with loved ones are dying. People suffering from Alzheimers (and numerous other debilitating diseases) are doing so needlessly. Marijuana and extracts are non-toxic.. You can smoke, vaporize or eat 10 grams of extract and not ‘overdose’. There is no need to allow people to suffer while science catches up with what the rest of us already know from personal experience.

            I should add, people who are going through these clinical studies are giving up their lives to prove to people like you that it works. 100 patients in a double blind with stage 4 cancer (and of course you’ll need at least 1 study for each kind of cancer, so we’re really talking 1000s of people here). Then, they’ll only be given singular components out of the plant extract for short periods of time. The one glio study was 9 patients for only 15 days AND it was ONLY THC, there was no CBD to target the cb2 receptor (The glio have CB1 and CB2 receptors). This not even mentioning the other cannabinoids which are found preclinically to have an angiogenisis affect. And, these same people have already had multiple rounds of chemo lasting periods of weeks or months. 15 days, really? IMO, the doctor who did that study basically murdered people to determine that high doses of THC are safe on the brain. No shit! Captain fucking obvious killed 9 people. Then, FINALLY maybe 10 years from now they’ll actually start using multiple cannabinoids from the plant extract and actually seeing that it works! Woo hoo! yay, we’ll finally start curing cancers! omg! medical sciences at work! Ya know, clinical studies are great, and I’d also like to have them, but how about just doing a clinical study on people who are already WANTING to take the whole plant extract? Then, just simply act as a recorder, monitor their doses, determine side effects and efficacy? Nah, fuck all that, we’ll do it ‘our way’ and butcher some people in the process. That 8 years of medical college may make you think you’re superior to the rest of us layman, but what you lost in that 8 years is common sense.

          • Acleron

            So you have no robust evidence but are willing if not eager to make claims.

            Your argument of personal experience is used by all the charlatans in the world from homeopaths to those selling bleach for autism.

          • omfgwtfbbq

            Do you think there is also no evidence that cannabinoids reduce or nearly eliminate epileptic seizures? What about parkinsons?

            For me personally, doctors would rather have me on levodopa than vaporizing oils. The affect on my body is literally identical. The only difference is, with levodopa there are terrible migraines and I have trouble sleeping due to the incredibly vivid dreams. Should I accept the migraines and sleepless nights waiting for science to catch up? Or should I just take what I know works? .. Oh, and lets not forget the hallucinations I sometimes experience on L-dopa. I had an auditory hallucination last night! fun times!!! Yet, I’m not allowed to take marijuana because it’s psychoactive! hahaha! what a joke.

          • Acleron

            Doctors and scientists are trying to find the facts of this matter. If we accepted unverified anecdotes we would be back in the 15th century.

          • omfgwtfbbq

            And, if doctors don’t listen to their patients they’d be no better than used car salesmen.

          • Acleron

            They do listen but translating your unverified anecdotes into treatment recommendations for others is something no responsible professional would do.

          • omfgwtfbbq

            And if 5 patients say the same thing? What about 10? What about 50? 100? At what point for you are anecdotes no longer anecdotal?

          • Acleron

            When those anecdotes are confirmed by clinical trials.

            Homeopaths have produced thousands who have said homeopathy works but when tested clinically no effect is seen.

          • omfgwtfbbq

            So, doctors should listen to but ignore their patients? And, ignore their suffering? At least, until years have passed and a microbiologist has finished preclinical work; then additional years have passed and a clinical trial has been conducted and completed? So, you’re saying I should just wait and suffer? What if the drug I say helps me is schedule 1 — considered to have ‘no medical benefits’. Is thus unavailable or a practical impossibility for a microbiologist to obtain for preclinical work? What do I do then? Just die?

          • Acleron

            You can take what you want. Using your experiences to advise others without robust evidence is wrong. You actually don’t know if marijuana works for you because you are an uncontrolled trial of one.

          • omfgwtfbbq

            Except, according to parkinson.org at 40 NPF centers over ->80%<- of parkinson's patients have tried or consumed marijuana and reported their experiences. So it's not a trial of one. Unfortunately for the traditional medicine establishment, humans by nature love nothing more than to share experience. If one person finds that something works for them, they will share their experience with others. Those others may try it and if it works for them (or even if it doesnt) they will share that experience with others. When it helps enough people, you end up with what is happening now for marijuana. A tidal wave of people railing against the traditional medical establishment for being too slow, claiming that they're uncaring, that they're trying to suppress treatments that work, etc. It's not a trial of one when millions of others are doing a trial of one at the same time. There are more people reporting positive results that can be explained away by placebo effect. My neurologist just the other day said that her patients are begging her to allow them to try marijuana. Unfortunately for the patients, I'm currently living in the philippines where they summarily execute drug dealers on sight. Hence the reason I'm currently on levodopa.. I can't find marijuana because the president is giving money to the police officers to execute people for selling a plant loaded with medicinal value. But, even with people knowing that they will be executed, many I know are still risking death to grow and consume it because it works for them. I'm still in the process of building my grow room.

          • Acleron

            Each one is a trial of one because there is nothing to compare it with, absolutely nothing.

            The reason why the medical establishment is slow is because we have so many examples of drugs and treatments that showed an early but false promise.

            You have almost no evidence that marijuana is loaded with medicinal value although a recent trial claims a 50% reduction in seizures due to epilepsy.

            For somebody railing against the medical establishment, you show a cavalier disregard to effectiveness and safety.

          • omfgwtfbbq

            For precisely the reasons I mentioned. Over 30% of the US population has consumed marijuana. Some studies say up to 50%. Personally, I know dozens of people who’ve consumed marijuana on a daily basis for decades. There are millions of others who have consumed marijuana on a daily basis for decades. If there were any long term negative consequences, they’d show.

            The only clinical study I know of which shows any potential negative consequence for long term marijuana use… Used methylphendate to attempt to stimulate dopamine release in the brain while under MRI. In that study, long term marijuana users released significantly less dopamine than non-marijuana users. HOWEVER, Without having the same study done prior to the long term use of marijuana you can’t draw any conclusions. The self-medication hypothesis applies. You can’t say that marijuana is the cause of it when they could have been like that before and used marijuana to treat the symptoms of their underlying condition.

            Can you show me any studies which show negative long term effects of marijuana or derivative compounds which can’t be explained away by the self-medication hypothesis? With the decades of prohibition.. surely there must be something providing backing for the governments classification of schedule 1? Can you show me any study even in vitro that shows any potential negative consequence to long term or short term use of marijuana?

          • Acleron

            It is not possible to do safety trials when the effective dose, if any, is unknown. It is easy to lurch into recommendations when you have no idea of the complexity of finding out.

            Marijuana is a complex mixture with a large variability of individual materials. Anecdotal evidence is less than useful.

          • omfgwtfbbq

            Sure you can, you just use unreasonable amounts. There was a study done on tobacco where they took smoke tar and pasted it onto the skin of rats. In that study, all of the rats developed massive malignant tumors in the area where the tar was applied. The tobacco usage of people may vary, but the study surely shows that sustained long term contact with tobacco tar can and will eventually cause cellular mutations that lead to cancer. Yes, one person may smoke for 60 years and never get a cancer, another person may smoke for 60 years and get cancer. Just because one person didn’t undergo the cellular mutations doesn’t mean that they weren’t at risk for it. It would be relatively easy to do the same thing for marijuana. Take extract oils, marijuana smoke tar, etc, paste it on the back of rats, do they develop massive malignant tumors? yes or no. It’s a pretty simple experiment that could be done in a high school setting. And, I could probably think up a dozen other tests that could be done in a high school setting which would show any negative consequence. An example, take brain material of rats and grow it in a petri dish. Divide the petri dishes into control and study sample. In the study sample apply copious amounts of cannabinoids and grow the cellular material for a period of years. Compare the cellular material of the control group to the study group. What differences are there, if any? They were able to in a college setting grow and train a rat brain in a petri dish to fly a F-22 fighter jet simulator. So, don’t tell me it’s not possible. Maybe even take those rat brains that fly f-22 jet simulators and see what cognitive deficits long term marijuana use may have over that of a control group. After 2 years of copious amounts of thc, cbd, etc, can they still fly the jet as effectively as the control group?

          • Acleron

            Your experiment would not disclose anything, overdosing is an easy way of showing toxicity.

            You need the therapeutic dose and then the cost benefit ratio in a phase I study.

            There is far more work in determining if a treatment works than just ‘it works for me’. If pharmaceutical companies could avoid this massive amount of work, they would.

          • omfgwtfbbq

            True, but we weren’t talking about therapeutic doses. You said “It is not possible to do safety trials when the effective dose, if any, is unknown” and “For somebody railing against the medical establishment, you show a cavalier disregard to effectiveness and safety.”. Overdosing beyond any possible therapeutic value is a perfect way to determine safety (at least in the short term) of a drug. Once the safety is determined, the therapeutic doses can be dialed in. Further, in vitro, cancer for instance was killed at a level of around 3mg/L of solution. Would it not be logical to assume that cancer would be killed in vivo at the same levels? The glio trial (which was used to determine safety, not efficacy) used a dosage of 180mg/L of solution. However, they did not also target the cb2 receptor with cannabidiol and only did the trial for 15 days with the exception of 2 patients who later received follow up doses.

            You’ve also completely sidestepped my question as to why marijuana would be schedule 1 and why it continues to be schedule 1… Like 3 or 4 times now. You yourself have said that clinical studies of epilepsy have shown a 50% decrease in seizure rates; effectively admitting it does have medicinal value. The only reason any clinical or preclinical work can be done in the united states these days is due to 10th amendment states rights. By bypassing the federal government and usurping their authority on such matters it finally allows people to get their hands on the substance to study. Until then, pretty much every single such study was done outside the US. So, why does the federal government continue to insist that marijuana and derivatives have no medicinal value?

            You also sidestepped the question as to why there haven’t been any real studies done on the long term safety of marijuana. If a substance is schedule 1 and has no medical benefits, shouldn’t there be data to back that up? Or is requirement of proof only applicable when making claims of medicinal value? Is proof not needed to claim that a substance is harmful and should be prohibited?

            Like, if I were to say, vitamin c is bad, it’s psychoactive! it should banned! Do I need data to back that up? Or is that argument only one way?

          • Acleron

            First you have to estimate the therapeutic dose and then test the toxicity of that dose in humans. Animal and in vitro studies just give indications, they are not definitive.

            At the moment neither the efficacy or toxicity of marijuana as a medical treatment has been determined, that’s why the clinical trials are being done.

            Your diversion into the politico legal area is irrelevant. We need to know if it is a useful treatment.

          • omfgwtfbbq

            Ok, so in order to schedule a drug 1, you don’t need any actual proof that the substance has no medical value nor any proof that it has toxicity. And, that, there’s no medical basis for the schedule 1 of the drug.

            What I’ve taken away from our conversation is that.

            #1) Doctors should listen to their patients
            #2) Doctors should ignore their patients after listening to them

            #3) People who are sick should just die.

            #4) Studies done on the general population by analyzing reality versus expectations are useless.

            #5) If taking a drug cures you, or reduces symptoms, you should shut up and not discuss it with anyone.
            #6) Data collected by doctors is useless.

            Sorry but, Marijuana extracts help with my parkinsons. If anyone has parkinsons, you should try it. Will it work for you? I don’t know, but it’s certainly worth the attempt. Or, you can follow this guy’s advice: Ignore me and enjoy your freezing, stumbling, in ability to do anything correctly, and the depression from realizing how fucked you are.

          • Acleron

            You have failed to take anything from what I’ve said.

            You don’t know if marijuana helps with your condition, you just think so. You don’t even know what you took, marijuana is not precisely defined and individual materials vary greatly.

            Despite your lack of knowledge you are irresponsibly advising others to take something which may be ineffective and will certainly have other effects and possibly incite them to break the law.

            I haven’t given any advice except wait until we find out more about treatment with marijuana.

          • omfgwtfbbq

            Ya, I don’t have another 50 years to wait for research to catch up to what I already know.

          • Acleron

            The problem is that you don’t know. You may have convinced yourself that you do but you don’t. We don’t do difficult clinical trials for fun but we have found them to be necessary because personal testimony such as yours is unreliable.

            Advising others is irresponsible.

          • omfgwtfbbq

            Except for, it’s already well established that…

            #1) Parkinsons is characterized as a lack of dopamine in the brain (from natural production)
            #2) THC blocks the release of GABA
            #3) GABA modulates and prevents dopamine release / uptake

            Thus, when consuming THC, it blocks the release of GABA, which in turn allows you to produce more dopamine and allows your cells to consume the natural dopamine which is released (in greater qty due to THC).

          • Acleron

            All that is fine but it still doesn’t translate to a treatment because marijuana has been found to block GABA. If drug development was confined to seeing a possible mechanism and marketing then we would have more ineffective and toxic drugs than we do.

          • omfgwtfbbq

            GABA antagonists are found to help with parkinson’s and are regularly prescribed for the disease. The problem is, all of the GABA antagonists on the market are extremely damaging with a list of side effects as long as your arm. Neurologist (at least mine) doesn’t want or tend to prescribe GABA antagonists due to the side effects. THC is a gaba antagonist which can be consumed in relatively low doses — what would be considered to be within the realm of heavy recreational use. What I find helps me is around 500mg of THC over a 24 hour period. That would translate to the consumption of roughly 750mg-1gram of extract per day.. Depending on the percentile of THC in the cannabinoid extracts.

            Now you’re just being disingenuous to prove your point. The medical knowledge is all there. THC has been studied clinically and proven to be a GABA antagonist. Simply because there isn’t a double blind study on a group of parkinson’s patients doesn’t make the fundamental science any less true.

          • Acleron

            There is no medical knowledge to prepare any component of marijuana for treatment because we have not done the work required.

            Claims that ‘it works for me’ are made by homeopaths, chiros, Reiki, supplement salesmen and many other charlatans. We perform clinical trials to find out if claims like yours are correct. Often they are found not to be.

            If we find a characterised component of marijuana to be therapeutically useful and safe then great but at the moment we and you don’t know.

          • omfgwtfbbq

            So, what you’re saying is that all clinical work done on cannabinoids proving by scientific method what they do within the brain are useless? So, even if there are 5 studies proving that THC is a gaba antagonist, that doesn’t mean that it is a gaba antagonist?

            There is no medical knowledge to prepare any component of marijuana for treatment? What about the the ones that are already approved for use as a treatment outside the USA by a country’s FDA equivalency? Those don’t exist?

            A medicial professional using the word ‘safe’ is an oxymoron considering how often medical professionals prescribe unsafe treatments to patients. The L-dopa I’m on now is not safe. The gaba antagonists are not safe. I’m failing to see how I’m gaining or losing any possible safety by using (or not) marijuana extracts?

            You’ve really lost me in your attempt to save face. I guess I’ll just keep doing what I know works for me and you can have your 50 years to figure out what I already know.

          • Acleron

            Stop misrepresenting what I say.

            Knowing that something has an activity does not translate into a useful therapy. 99%+ of chemicals that have activity in primary screening do not progress to treatments.

          • omfgwtfbbq

            I was reading between the lines. And, I was curious how you’d react to scientific information versus clinical trials.

            https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24614667 — of course done outside the USA, because in the USA, marijuana has ‘no medicinal value’. So yes, THC helps people with PD. Proven. With ‘No significant adverse effects’.

            99% of chemicals don’t make it to treatments because they are synthetic compounds dreamed up in some super lab. You can’t patent nature unless you make alterations to it. The medical sciences you’re involved in are something new. It’s taken the scientific method and turned it into a hammer used to beat people down. Because, you can’t charge $10,000 a dose for something that anyone is able to make. In the case of marijuana, people can make cannabinoid extracts in their back yard. There is every incentive to make sure that it stays criminalized, and every incentive to stifle research. Then they can keep pushing synthetic compounds keeping profits high.

            How much money will be lost by Merck annually if people are no longer buying their levodopa compound? $50-$150 per month per patient in the US. Roughly 1 million parkinsons patients. When people start consuming THC for their PD merck stands to lose nearly $1billion a year in annual revenue.

            I’m not sure why you wouldn’t understand why people don’t trust medical professionals. Everything about the current medical process, other than the scientific method it’s founded on, is wrong.

            Keep on pushing your synthetic compounds. I’ll take what I knew worked for me long before the medical science caught up with it. I’ll take what I knew worked for me long after the medical sciences finally realize that it does work.

          • Acleron

            Everything in marijuana is a chemical, it doesn’t matter if it is synthesised by man in a lab or by a plant.

            All the old tropes are coming out now. Medical science has contributed to people living longer, healthier and as a consequence wealthier, it is not an enemy.

            Why do people distrust medicine? Is that projection? Doctors are overworked treating people, seems like the majority trust the system.

            And yet again, you have no idea what works for you.

            Advising others to go into heavy recreational use is dangerous.

          • omfgwtfbbq

            Now who’s misrepresenting? Yes, they’re all chemicals. The difference is in how they’re produced and why. Chemicals in nature have evolved naturally through processes of natural selection. There are reasons for their existence as it helps them combat disease, reproduce, live longer, become stronger than other plant and animal species in a given environment. In contrast, medicine today has become a process of trial and error by fire. Randomly producing compounds in a lab and then trying them against various ailments in the hopes that one of them will be found to have some therapeutic affect against some randomly selected ailment. Then, can be patented and then sold at unreasonable rates. Compounds that are produced which are found to have no immediate benefit are stored in compound collections for a rainy day.

            Why do people distrust medicine? 20% in the UK don’t trust nurses, 15% don’t trust doctors. I couldn’t say why they do or don’t, here are my personal views:

            Step 1) doctors

            Doctors are just one step in the process..

            I find doctors to be people who generally have good intentions for doing what they do. They want to help people. But, at the same time, going through that 8 years of medical school gives them a sense of superiority which drowns their patients. They hold on to scientific process as a methodology while at the same time still bringing their own preconceived and sometimes ill-conceived beliefs to the table. You can go to 5 different doctors about a list of symptoms and get 5 different possible causes as to your symptoms. Go to an oncologist, they’ll think it’s cancer. Go to a psychologist, they’ll tell you it’s all in your head. Go to a Cardiologist and they’ll think it’s a stroke or heart attack. Go to a pulmonologist and they’ll think it’s an embolism in your lungs. Go to a doctor of internal medicine and they’ll think it’s an infection. Who you go to determines what is wrong with you. It’s a guessing game and sometimes it’s near impossible to determine what is actually wrong with you. Even simple things like taking blood pressure are really unclear. I get high blood pressure just from being in the doctors office, so everytime i go my BP is elevated. But if I take my BP at home, it’s not elevated.

            Beyond all of this, as you mentioned, they’re overworked. When someone is overworked they’re more prone to miss details, make mistakes, and be less effective at their job. There are studies which state 10-20% of diagnosis will be misdiagnosis. And, of those 20% who have been misdiagnosed 28% will be life threatening. Of 1 million diagnosed, 56,000 will have a life threatening misdiagnosis.To me, that is alarming. Every time you go to a doctor for a problem you have a 2.3%-5.6% chance to have a miss diagnosis that is life threatening. You have a better chance to get a life threatening misdiagnosis than you do to win a small jackpot at a casino slot machine.

            If, in my job as an engineer, I constantly misdiagnosed problems, I would be fired. Yet, in medicine, it’s considered to be acceptable and even a normal process of diagnostic process. Trial and error to figure out what is wrong is unacceptable. I have been trained to determine with 100% certainty what a problem is before acting on the problem. Suspicion is unacceptable.

            step 2) door to door drug dealers

            Then, you have the medicines that the doctors prescribe to you. There are legal drug dealers who’s sole job it is to travel around and get doctors to prescribe medicine. They don’t care really if the drug works or not; their job is to sell. They’re door to door drug dealers. They’ll go to doctors and push drugs onto the doctors citing various factoids and studies, many of which were published by their own company (and who knows if those facts are even true, as in some cases, they’re not.). Every doctor i’ve ever been to has those samples on premises from multiple companies (and I’ve been to doctors in 3 different countries). Given to them by these door to door drug dealers. What if a doctor is less than ethical (because that never happens, right?)? Maybe they’ll start prescribing a drug in exchange for favors. Maybe just for example, drug A might have a higher incidents of this or that side effect than drug B that they’re currently prescribing.

            And, again, as you said, doctors are overworked. When do they have the time to read studies, literature, etc for themselves? You yourself probably weren’t aware of the cannabis PD clinical studies. But, you’re on here preaching to me that I’m a charlatan instead of reading these studies for yourself. Doctors trust the pharmaceutical companies.

            step 3) ‘big pharma’

            You have the whole pharmaceutical company aspect to this. These companies are driven by purely profit motivations. The most profitable drugs are ones that can be patented. As such, they have no interest in looking to nature for drugs. They only want compounds which can be synthesized and patented. So, they have these labs where all they do all day long is create new compounds to test against various possible aliments. This is called the ‘drug discovery cycle’.

            The large majority of drugs that people take every day came from nature. Everytime you go to a dentist and get a shot of lidocain, benzocain, etc. Those are all synthetic versions of alkaloids derived from the coca plant. Every time you have surgery, or require pain killers for a problem; they give you a synthetic opioid derived from the poppy plant. Asprin comes from willow bark, Penicilin from mold, on and on. This process of mass producing random chemical compounds in the lab and then seeing if they have any efficacy against any known ailment is relatively new in medicine.

            Step 4) FDA

            Then, you have the whole legislature and FDA portion of the process. This is a revolving door where people go from private sector to public sector back to private sector. The public railed against Dick Cheney for Haliburton contacts in Iraq, yet… This practice is perfectly normal and accepted for the FDA. You have people like Donald Rumsfeld who went from government to work at monsanto and back to government. Then, monsanto gets its ‘equivalency’ approval for genetically altered foods at the FDA and people start having allergic reactions to fish, while eating a tomato. People railed back demanding labeling of GMO foods, only to be denied any such labeling.

            There are numerous cases where drugs were approved for human use that were later revoked due to misrepresentations and outright lies during trials. Trials conducted by the company who manufactured a drug used to be (not sure if they still are) accepted by the FDA as proof of safety and efficacy. Third party trials are even paid for by the companies who make the drugs. Then, those third party ‘verification’ trials which were bought and paid for (quite literally) by the drug manuf are used as proof of safety and efficacy.

            Then, not to mention more heinous things like (but not limited to) — giving black men syphillis, testing nuclear radiation against 7th day adventists, bayer giving people aids with knowingly tainted factor VIII, on and on and on.

            Then, you have the scheduling system which historically has been used as a method to get rid of people deemed ‘undesirable’ to currently accepted societal norms. Substances like marijuana are deemed schedule 1, with no substantiating evidence to prove that there is no medicinal value. This is completely contrary to scientific method. They make claims without any substantiating evidence. Then, they use this as a basis to deny the substance to researchers who wish to examine if a substance has any actual medicinal value. Before 2016, NO ONE IN THE ENTIRE UNITED STATES COULD LEGALLY ACQUIRE MARIJUANA FOR RESEARCH PURPOSES! There have been petitions to move it from schedule to schedule 3 dating as far back as the 1970s. The FDA time and again say that the substance has no medical value. As far as i’m aware, cannabis is the only plant to contain cannabinoids which are able to target the endocannabinoid system. The 2 countries which are at the forefront of research into the ECS and Cannabinoids are Israel, and Spain. Cannabis has been shown to have more medicinal compounds and possibilities than any other plant I’m aware of. Yet, the FDA maintains the plant has ‘no medicinal value’ — even as other countries are approving treatments based on cannabinoids found within the cannabis plant.

            Step 5) The money.

            Every single step in this chain is driven by for-profit motives. Doctors need to see patients, prescribe drugs, order tests, and work to make money. It’s become a lot like being a lawyer. More and more people are going into the field to make money, not to help people.

            Drug dealers need to go door to door and push their products onto doctors to make money. In many cases they’re paid on commission. They’re are purely driven by profit and as salesmen are going to be more eager to lie or misrepresent to get a sale.

            Pharmaceutical companies need to develop new compounds so they can continually have new patents that they’re able to charge obscene amounts for in single doses. So, they randomly produce compounds that are loosely related to old compounds and then try to see if there’s any efficacy over a wide range of possible ailments. The pharma companies have no idea what the long term safety of these substances will be. They are actually required by law in the US to be solely concerned for the profit of their investors. Not only are they motivated by monetary reasons, they’re required by law to be motivated by monetary reasons.

            The people within the FDA leave the FDA and go work for pharmaceutical companies. If someone working within the FDA doesn’t get drugs approved, they’re not going to get a job after leaving the FDA if and when that ever happens. There is a research paper that showed from 2001 to 2010 25% of 55 reviewers who approved or were involved in the approval of cancer and hematological drugs at the FDA left and now work or consult for pharma companies. 25%!!! There are even cases of insider trading involving FDA reviewers who know a drug will get approved.

            ….

            I’ve personally been misdiagnosed several times, including once by a psychologist who told me it was ‘all in my head’. My wife was told she was fine and perfectly healthy. I noticed a growing list of symptoms and after a period of time determined she had PCOS. We went to the doctor, did the various testing and did indeed determine she has PCOS and is prediabetic. We’ve changed her diet to remove the sugar and carbs, she’s starting to get back to normal. I’ve seen my parents, grand parents and other loved ones fall victim to this for profit medical trap. Grandfather goes to a doctor with intestinal problems, ah, it’s probably just gas, or indigestion. Nope, turned out to be cancer that had spread to his brain before they bothered to actually look.

            People do have a right to earn a living, and generally, live well. What makes it a problem is when the for profit factor is the only motivator. When you have to analyze a doctor’s personality every time you see one to determine if they’re a decent human being, overworked, are prone to sloppy work, etc. It gets a bit overwhelming as it’s not like you’re going in to the doctor for a stubbed toe in the first place.

            So, you ask me why people don’t trust doctors. I would ask you, “Why should I trust a doctor? — or further, anyone in the medical establishment?”. I’ve found the only way to be sure something is done right is to spend the time to learn about it and do it yourself. Only then will it get done properly, that you can’t count on others to do what needs to be done *properly*. And, when your life depends on it, it matters. I will await your 2liner reply.

          • Acleron

            There is no difference at all. Plants don’t evolve to treat humans, they just have interesting chemicals.

            Your uneducated views on chemistry, biology and medical science are not reasons for you to make claims nor to advise others on medical matters. An engineer is hardly who to go to for medicine.

            Your misrepresentations of what I said amounted to lies.

          • omfgwtfbbq

            Cool, sue me for slander, let’s see if a jury agrees with you. And, on that note and 2 liner reply that I knew was coming. I’m going to go smoke a joint and tell some more people elsewhere to try THC for their PD.

            If you can’t see how there isn’t a difference in noting that a compound in nature has antibacterial properties, and randomly developing 10,000 compounds in the lab HOPING one has antibacterial properties. I’m not sure what to tell you.

          • Acleron

            Sue you? Crazy talk.

          • omfgwtfbbq

            No less crazy than thinking that randomly developing compounds in the lab is equivalent to observing nature. Noticing that some mold kill off other fungi and mold as they grow is substantially different than developing 100,000 unknown compounds in the hopes that one kills off mold or fungi and has a low toxicity in humans.

          • Acleron

            If you think that finding new drugs is easy you are living in cloud cuckoo land. The very fact that scientists are investigating marijuana gives the lie to that idea.

            Your simplistic view of how medical science works is not a reason to make your claims.

          • omfgwtfbbq

            I never said it was easy, what I said is that.. Randomly generating 100s of 1000s of compounds hoping that they have some therapeutic value, is new, and is not substantially equivalent to observing nature for answers to our own problems. Observing nature for clues as to compounds that can be used for medicinal purposes is the foundation of modern medicine along with the scientific method.

            Your misrepresentations of what I said amount to lies.

            “Nothing in the world is worth having or worth doing unless it means effort, pain, difficulty… I have never in my life envied a human being who led an easy life. I have envied a great many people who led difficult lives and led them well.” – Theodore Roosevelt

          • Acleron

            Observing nature is just part of medical science. Mass screening techniques are more efficient. The call to all things nature may be attractive to you but all the easy drugs have been found.

            You have demonstrated no insight into what is done in this area but you obviously think you are an expert. Dunning Kruger.

          • omfgwtfbbq

            If mass screening techniques are more efficient, why do we not have more randomly generated compounds today? Why are almost all medicinal compounds synthetic versions of compounds found in plants?

          • Acleron

            Why? Compare the numbers of drugs vs the number of new drugs per annum.

            The low hanging fruit has already been picked. All new chemicals whether plant, fungal or bacterial are primary screened to eliminate the useless. Those that pass are mostly dropped before clinical testing. Getting a drug to market is hard, your idea of guessing a dose and using anecdotal data is just nonsense.

          • omfgwtfbbq

            Apparently not if they’re just getting to marijuana.

          • Acleron

            LMAO a cursory look at pubmed lists over 25,000 publications for marijuana. You are really out of your depth.

          • omfgwtfbbq

            Duh, I’m trolling you.

          • Acleron

            Aww, was you annoyed? More likely it was that your attempt to get others to start ‘heavy recreational use’ was being refuted. Better stick to engineering and leave health care to professionals.

          • omfgwtfbbq

            Yes, it is better. So you should stop making recommendations that you have no idea what you’re talking about. There are clinical studies for marijuana use for PD. You’re advising people not to listen to what you claim is professional medicine.

          • Acleron

            Lol, you seem to have forgotten when I entered this sub thread. If you have phase I and II studies properly controlled then why waste time on demonstrating your ignorance of medical drug progression.

          • corbyh

            “Plants don’t evolve to treat humans”

            1) You’re missing the point. Terribly so.

            2) This isn’t even true. When plants (in their whole, natural form) are found to have medicinal uses or be effective at treating ailments for humans then humans become part of the natural selection process for those plants by preserving, propagating, hybridzing, and cultivating them.

          • Acleron

            omfgwtfbbq said
            ‘Chemicals in nature have evolved naturally through processes of natural selection. There are reasons for their existence as it helps them combat disease, reproduce, live longer, become stronger than other plant and animal species in a given environment’
            Looks like you missed the point.

            How would you determine which plants had the greater effect?

          • corbyh

            You’re doing the same thing you’ve done throughout this thread which is to conveniently forget which of your statements people are responding to here. You said, “Plants don’t evolve to treat humans.” I’ve posted a rebuttal to that. Do you have something to refute that rebuttal with? Or are you retracting your statement? (since it is demonstrably false)

          • Acleron

            The comment you responded to was a reply to omfg… In your response you claimed I had missed the point. You were wrong in all sorts of ways.

          • Acleron

            Do keep up.

          • gallo thiello

            Thank you for taking the time to elaborate for you know you are not feeding pears to swine. I relate to everything you said.

          • TagMan

            Acleron – improved HYGIENE has saved more lives than the whole damned medical “profession” EVER will! For god’s sake man – they aren’t GOD, they are PEOPLE and they LIE – just like OTHER people as has been proven in MANY of the so-called clinical studies. It is AMAZING how good something can sound just by OMITTING certain information. Are you REALLY that blind or are you just a totally, pathetic stirrer?

          • Acleron

            Nobody denies that sanitation and hygiene lead to mostly improved outcomes. However with those in place, people are still being injured and killed by disease. Hygiene and sanitation do not eliminate disease however vaccines can.

          • TagMan

            Here’s how it works omfgwtfbbq – according to science – (clinical trials and all) the bumblebee doesn’t have the wingspan to be able to fly but… the bumblebee hasn’t READ the study so he keeps on flying anyway and acleron refuses to BELIEVE he’s flying because the “clinical study” said it wasn’t possible.

          • Acleron

            You know little about science. Experimentation ie observation, shows that bumble bees do fly, nobody except idiots said they couldn’t.

          • TagMan

            WRONG AS USUAL acles. The Scinece digest published an article in the late 1960s explaining that the surface area od a bubmblebee’s wings was not great enough to provide the lift necessary for it to fly. It is scalar energy that makes it possible, But if you say it – in your mind it is true har har.

          • Acleron

            You really should get an education. The popular science magazine repeated the observation of a physicist that a fixed wing of bumblebee size could not carry its
            weight. There is no such thing as scalar energy, you are talking nonsense.

          • James Peters
          • Acleron

            Good, let’s hope it is well run, has high power and is successful.

          • TagMan

            Is that even POSSIBLE Acle? Have you SEEN the list of possible side effects of some of the drugs being promoted on TV? Are you saying they could add MORE side effects? WOW I WANT some haha. Actually maybe that’s what is wrong here YOU are taking them???

          • Acleron

            You wouldn’t need to, they’d come free if the only evidence required was that demanded by prograssers. You appear strangely devoid of logic and knowledge for someone claiming to be a scientist.

          • TagMan

            So just for interest (and i know you probably won’t answer this because you’ve not answered anything else) – where do you sit accles when something that you have decried for years because in your favourite words – it was “anecdotal” DOES get clinically trialled and PROVEN to work? Do you look back at all the people who died because people like you denied them access to it and say “well I was only doing the right thing?” Would you feel one OUNCE of guilt or STUPIDITY in taking your unyielding stance? No – I suppose you are a big enough jerk that you would brush it off – children and all.
            Looking forward to your answer but i appreciate that I might not live long enough to get one.

          • Acleron

            What a wonderful scam you run. I’m supposed to accept anything you say?

            You are a liar and a fraud.
            Why should anyone believe anything you say.

          • TagMan

            Thanks accles – proved my point – didn’t answer the question – just reverted to insults which do nothing but amuse me because I realise that’s all you’re capable of.

          • slooryder

            When one does have cancer perhaps one is more willing to look at the broader picture of alternative treatments. It is obvious that you are not interested in alternative cures however I can say that Hemp oil and sulfurophane have diminished and perhaps eliminated my cancer. The world is not flat and one needs to be open to other than the orthodox word. Please tell us how you treat you or yours should such diagnosis arise. Reality in ones life does dictate action.

          • Acleron

            You have no idea what interests me, for the record, it is evidence and science based treatments, uncontrolled anecdotes are not reliable evidence.

            You have pinpointed an emotional problem. When diagnosed with a serious disease, people are vulnerable to charlatans. Homeopaths, chiros etc are all very willing to sell their nostrums with anecdotes galore. They don’t mention those who don’t get better or even get worse. With fatal diseases, they literally bury any evidence against.

          • slooryder

            It is fortunate for the world that many pioneers did not share your views.

          • Acleron

            Which pioneers produced new drugs without evidence?

          • TagMan

            Damn – you are the poster child of the medical profession eh Acleron… take this med… there are 750 potential side effects INCLUDING death but HEY – it just MIGHT cure you (sorry help to manage your illness) too har har… Any doctor reading your posts must get a tear in the eye mate – they must LOVE you.

          • Acleron

            Certainly asking for evidence causes people like you to come out with the most amazing BS.

          • TagMan

            Yep but there’s no question you are the champion Accy. Remember when cigarettes were being prescribed by doctors? Were they “clinically reviewed” first? Just wondering?

          • TagMan

            Just for interest Acleron – how many “clinical” trials were done before it was medically agreed that bullets kill people?

          • TagMan

            OMG – your favourite people using “clinically trialled shit” kill more people EVERY YEAR in the US than all the chiropractors, homeopaths and even PSYCOPATHS in the WOrLD kill in TEN you lunatic!

            ackiebaby is a two word man folks – “clinical trial” – he doesn’t understand ANYTHING outside of those two words and even overlooks the FACT that clinical trials are carried out by PEOPLE – JUST like US. They have JOBS and they have to PROTECT those jobs and they LIE – often at the cost of thousands of injured people around the world. But HEY – if it had “clinically trialled” on the box ackiebaby and “lostthefarm joe” and kookoo karin woud eat SLIME HAR HAR HAR.

          • Acleron

            Any evidence that people who use clinical trials to provide evidence are killing more than they save?

            People who perform clinical trials are nothing like you. In general they don’t lie as you do. Just because you are a liar who flogs useless gimcrackery for profit, don’t assume everyone has your gutter morals.

            I can easily see why clinical trials upset you, they show you are charlatan.

          • TagMan

            Mate PLEASE delete this post. Saying the earth isn’t flat is likely to start ANOTHER round of stupidity from the acleberry team and i don’t know if my head could handle that har har.

          • James Peters

            GW Pharma sponsored the trials in patients with Dravet and Lennox-Gastaut syndrome. They plan to submit a single NDA to the FDA for both indications. Epidiolex (a proprietary oral solution of pure plant-derived CBD) will then be approved soon after. Their 3rd and 4th target indications for the drug are Tuberous Sclerosis Complex and Infantile Spasms.

          • corbyh

            “When those anecdotes are confirmed by clinical trials.”

            Why would anyone bother to confirm anecdotes with clinical trials if anecdotes are dismissed out of hand as being useless and irrelevant?

          • Acleron

            Don’t be ridiculous. Anecdotes are not used as treatment recommendations by responsible people. Who said they are never investigated?

          • Tasha Elizabeth

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          • TagMan

            And nobody tells lies in these “peer reviewed journals” right Acleron? Yeah RIGHT!!

          • Acleron

            When any scientist acts fraudulently the consequences are severe and their career is usually terminated. If it was only the same for the BS you promote…

          • TagMan

            The HUGE assumption here is that those “peer reviewed studies” are not fake. Check out Dr. Salk finally admitting that the polio vaccination was a farce…

          • Acleron

            You will have to give a reference for that. The Salk killed vaccine was insufficiently effective to eliminate polio but still reduced incidence. It was expensive and required three injections plus a booster. Polio was vastly reduced by the Sabin live oral vaccine.

          • TagMan

            And what questions have YOU answered mister know-it-all? Your belief system is SO absurd that if you saw a person smashed by a run-away car you wouldn’t accept that the car could kill people because it hadn’t been tested in peer reviewed clinical trials. OMG!!!

          • Acleron

            We are not discussing car crashes, or hadn’t you noticed?

          • thaddeusbuttmunchmd

            OK-I have issues with BOTH sides of this argument. Again, I am a Traditionally-trained physician. “Cut, Burn, Poison” CAN be harmful (even Deadly) and not kill the Tumor-but that depends on the tissue type. Childhood Leukemias, Hodgkin’s Lymphoma, Testicular Cancer, and Choriocarcinoma of the Endometrium (which consists of Fetal tissue after childbirth) used to be DEADLY-especially the Latter. ALL are curable with Old-Fashioned Chemotherapy. Admittedly, some of these are “Zebra” (Rare) Diseases. 85% of Lung Cancer, and Large percentages of Esophageal, Head and Neck, Pancreas and Bladder Cancers are related to various forms of Tobacco-so don’t DO it. Smoke the “Good” stuff instead! (but Vaping and ingesting is Healthier.) Breast, Colon and Prostate can be screened for. They account for a Large Percentage of Cancer Deaths. Getting a Colonoscopy after Fifty years of age (and, in some instances, earlier) is a Vital and noncontroversial way to get rid of Polyps, thus preventing more radical surgery and/or Death. Ovarian and Pancreatic Cancers are “Hidden” tumors. Perhaps Targeted PET scans Bianually or “Dognostics” (Dogs are GREAT at sniffing out early Cancer) will allow them to be Diagnosed at an Earlier Stage.

            Bloodletting and Mercury “Quack Silver” WERE used by Doctors and were Harmful, but that was Long Ago. The “Natural Healers” in Those Days thought that Plague was caused by a misalignment of Heavenly Bodies and that hanging nostrums around your neck prevented it. I recently attended a “Targeted Therapy” Lecture about cutting-edge Cancer treatments. There are VERY promising Immunotherapies, such as checkpoint inhibitors, and small molecule inhibitors coming online for the Treatment of Cancer.

          • thaddeusbuttmunchmd

            PS: Skin Exams for Melanoma are Vital, Too. The Pap Smear, and now, the HPV Vaccine, are saving MANY women’s lives.

          • Vladimir Stanescu

            One last effort (from the article in the link):
            “Let us look first at tetrahydrocannabinol (THC) and observe that THC is
            a natural fit for the CB1 cannabinoid receptor on the cancer cell
            surface. When THC hits the receptor, the cell generates ceramide that
            disrupts the mitochondria, closing off energy for the cell. Disruption
            of the mitochondria releases cytochrome c and reactive oxygen species
            into the cytosol, hastening cell death. It is notable that this process
            is specific to cancer cells. Healthy cells have no reaction to THC at
            the CB1 receptor. The increase in ceramide also disrupts calcium
            metabolism in the mitochondria, completing the demise to cell death.
            “The other cannabinoid we know is effective in killing cancer cells is
            cannabidiol (CBD). The primary job of CBD in the cancer cell is to
            disrupt the endoplasmic reticulum through the wrecking of the calcium
            metabolism, pushing calcium into the cytosol. This always results in
            cell death. Another pathway for CBD to effect cancer cell death is the
            caspase cascade, which breaks down proteins and peptides in the cell.
            When this happens the cell cannot survive. Again, these processes are
            specific to cancer cells, no normal cells are affected.”

          • Vladimir Stanescu

            What, no attack yet on the Harvard quack and his snake oil claims ? Hmmmm…
            Different time zones I suspect…

          • Vladimir Stanescu

            I know there are lots of quacks who sell lots of snake oil. I am not a physician, just a guy who wants to know as much as possible about a limited field or another, especially when that limited field is directly linked to unimportant things like his life.
            In my case and other 2 I know personally, the RSO worked as advertised, in a dose-dependant manner. From what I read, there are reports of other cases. Why nobody petitons to do a real clinical study ? Like diagnosed patients, even terminally ill, to sign up for this clinical trial – 3-6 months. I bet thousands would register in seconds.
            The ones I read about (few) were laughing stocks, really. The trials I mean.
            I will ask you another thing: why is cannabis listed as a Schedule I substance, the highest classification ? It was used as a medicinal plant until 1931 I think. I can tell you from experience that it doesn’t induce addiction and has mild to none side effects.
            On the other hand, some 8 million american are struggling for years to quit Valium.
            And the other thing is you said “cured”. By “cured” I mean at least 5 years cancer-free, no ?
            But from what I saw, that happens rarely. In my opinion, that is because the entire action of chemo agents (killing all the cells in the order of their multiplication speed) is wrong. And it destroys the immune system. According to Dr. Dennis Hill, a biochemist at Harvard who cured his PCa, the cannabinoids, especially the THC and CBD, have the ability to target only the abnormal cells. The THC destroys their mythocondria walls and the CBD inhibits their metabolism by limiting their blood supply. Here is a link:
            http://reset.me/story/the-biochemist-who-cured-his-cancer-with-cannabis-oil/
            That is all, I really have no more time, sorry, don’t want to offend you. Frankly, I was hoping to contribute to the start of something good, but I realize now it’s not gonna happen, at least not in this century.

          • poppy72

            Went to your link, wrong, I was diagnosed with cancer in 2005 had chemo doing well in 2017 Umm thats 12 years yet your link stated only 5 years Ummm.

          • TagMan

            Not disagreeing with you entirely BUT… there is no one thing that is the answer to all. Frankincense oil is ALSO shown to measurably reduce tumours. High dose intravenous vitamin C has cured cancer, thermal treatment can kill cancer, curcumin is a known cancer killer and yes, cannabis oil has also proven to kill cancer… the list goes on and not all things work for all people.

          • Paulina Schaiy

            At 47 I was diagnosed with breast cancer. My treatment included a full mastectomy of my right breast to remove one tumor and all lymph nodes in my right arm. Followed by chemotherapy and radiation.
            Three years later I have been diagnosed with stage 4 metastatic breast cancer. I now have 4 tumors:
            1) Left under arm in a lymphnode.
            2) Liver
            3) Right side diaphram
            4) Base of right lung
            I am now taking Ibrance and Letrozole.
            I am a very 51 years young!
            I am 5″6, 125 lbs. I have no other health concerns.
            I went from being told, “If you want any chance of living a long life, you must have surgery, chemo and radiation.”
            I did every thing my doctor suggested and yet here I am less than 5 years later with terminal cancer.
            Real life evidence.
            Conventional medicine has failed me miserably.
            So while I will continue with Ibrance and Letrozole, I will also continue alternative therapies, a vegan diet and my belief in God to live a long, healthy and productive life.

          • Acleron

            I’m terribly sorry for your suffering. You took the best path for a cure and it didn’t work.

        • rusty

          https://youtu.be/QvC6vvEoGo0 watch this as well 🙂

      • Vladimir Stanescu

        Yes, it does, Sir. And you don’t have to do anything other than reach the correct dose of approx 1ml pure cannabis oil per day and keep it until all the markers are at the lowest possible value. 1:1 CBD/THC ratio helps. The THC destroys the mithocondria membranes and the CBD inhibits the cells’ metabolism by limiting their blood supply. They are far less efectve than most chemo drugs, but they target only the cancer cells. Worked for me and for 2 friends of mine, one with lymphoma and one with pancreatic t3 cancer (he is still in remission though, we are cancer-free). On the other hand, your chemo and radio killed my mother, my cousin and 4 of my dear friends and colleagues in a short period of time. I don’t blame you – most of you are “injected” in school and impervious to reason. I blame the governments which banned this medicinal plant with no side effects and no addiction to promote Valium and other drugs that should be banned for side effects and addiction.

        • thaddeusbuttmunchmd

          I’m a physician myself, and think that Cannabis Oil is worthwhile-but, not necessarily as a standalone treatment. I am a member of a Cannabis Club. A Teenage Girl with Pontine Angle Glioblastoma takes the oil and her tumors have disappeared for Years. She was originally under Allopathic (Orthodox Medical) treatment at the University of Michigan. But, as you say, it must be the RIGHT oil. Mere refined Hemp Oil has healthy fats, but is worthless for Cancer. Why aren’t Hippies and Rastafarians who toke Marijuana more susceptible to Cancers, including Lung?? I certainly don’t think that ANY Burned Tar is Good for you, but the Cannabinoids are anti-carcinogens. The Baby Boomer Ex-Hippies are now reaching their Seventies, and should also be getting more Alzheimer’s Disease than they are. Cannabis can lower the incidence of THAT, Too, and it has become the Scourge of Humanity (worse than Cancer in some ways.)

          • rusty

            Most of those age related diseases are linked to dairy and meat consumption! Cannabis can help! Better to eat right in the first place so you will maybe never need weed at all! Just get baked for fun 🙂

          • thaddeusbuttmunchmd

            The Lack of enough fruits and vegetables can hurt more than a little meat. Super Sizing the Fries and Soda causes much trouble, Too. And-there’s a Difference between pasture-raised meat, and farmed meat-lunchmeat with nitrites are Especially Bad.

          • rusty

            A plant based diet can do wonders for our health! I’ve been on this diet for nearly two years, I never been this healthy since my early twenties! The studies on nutritionfacts.org has changed my our look on foods and illness! I know you are an medical professional, so have a chat with Dr michael gregor or dr Neil Barnard in regards to meat!

          • Daniel Spillett

            What a load of hippie vegan nonsense nature would not have given you canine teeth if you weren’t supposed to eat meat

          • rusty

            I suppose you had all your wisdom teeth removed then! LOL, all joking aside, we have shorter intestines than meat eating animals, those animals make their own vitamin c, we get ours from fruit! Just go to that website nutritionfacts.org go on man! Be wise!!!

          • TagMan

            True Rusty but how do you explain the Inuit? Vegetables don’t grow that well on the tundra and at least 90% of their diet is meat and fat (blubber)?

          • rusty

            They live a very short life! Many don’t l live pass 40, they have evolved over generations like the nordic people are able to drink milk without any problems! We on the other hand thrive on a plant based diet, we can live a long and healthy life with smart choices in our diet, exercise and scientific research!

          • TagMan

            According to an article in The Star Wed., Dec. 18, 2013 that is not entirely true. “Male life expectancy rose to 67.7 years from 63.5 years; among women, life expectancy rose to 72.8 years from 71.1 years

            But in the rest of Canada, male life expectancy rose to 77.5 years from 74.1 years and among females it rose to 81.3 years from 79.7 years.

            Not that far behind us and apparently a misleading factor is the number of deaths to “self-inflicted injuries and smoking.”

          • TwoDogs4Me

            Meat and dairy are inflammatory and take up a lot of the immune systems activity. Plant based dirt frees up the immune system to work on diseases. It’s not front line treatment but definitely adjuvant treatment

          • TagMan

            Rusty – I am a consummate vegetarian – I just like something else to eat the vegetables first. I don’t eat predators – the animals I eat consume vegetables only so their meat is just vegetable concentrate (come on – SMILE). In 50 years of working I’ve had 2 days off to illness (so many years ago I can’t remember when) I have never had the flu and I’ve only contracted a couple of colds when not getting enough rest for too long a period. My father at 95 can still outwalk most 20 year-olds, re-married at 91, has no particular aches or pains, his mind is still clear and dammit – HE’S a second hand vegetarian too?

          • rusty

            I know what you say seems like common sense but 91% of all rainforest deforestation is for animal agriculture, there won’t be a world for your grandchildren to grow up in if we continue to eat this way!! I’m glad you and your father are in good health! Have a great day sir.

          • TagMan

            No argument there Rusty but we have no idea of the consequences of eliminating those animals either. They are part of the ecosystem (see the wolves returned to Yellowstone) and there is no doubt most will become extinct under your auspices because no farmer is going to support anything that won’t sell.

          • rusty

            Farming is not natural and the wolves returning to yellowstone has nothing to do with farming, in fact wildlife has fallen as animal farming has grown, farmers can grow plant food, I’m not anti farming just animal farming!

          • TagMan

            I agree it has nothing to do with farming and I wasn’t comparing it to that mate. I was saying that when you eliminate a species the consequences may go far further than we realise. And I was RAISED on a farm and i can tell you, if people didn’t want meat or dairy any longer, those animals would have been gone in a week!

          • rusty

            That’s wrong too! There are farm animals shelters for cows sheep’s pigs answer many others as well! Farming is a man made unnatural contruct, most of the wild life has vanished over the last 100 years, that’s on us all.

          • TagMan

            Disagree but that’s ok… so the ‘animal shelters’ would become some sort of “zoos?” Look at the size of the herds that existed BEFORE farming rusty – hundreds of MILLIONS more than we have now and as an animal (assuming you could choose) would you rather a life where every MINUTE you were on watch for predators who in many cases will end up eating you alive, or on a farm where you don’t have a thing to worry about and the end comes swiftly? I know which i would go for. Seen a wounded elephant STILL alive after lions have been feeding on it for TWO DAYS rusty? DISGUSTING!

          • rusty

            And why do you think it’s for us to interfere with the natural world?
            why do you think the world is in so much trouble?
            we interfere with nature, we think we own the world,
            thats like fleas believing they own the dog! There isn’t an argument for what we are doing other than the greed of powerful people!
            Our children will pay a price for what’s happening today.

          • TagMan

            Can’t argue with the “interference” comment rusty but i think there are bigger problems to cleanup first. Plastic pollution in the oceans would be number one on my list, nitrogen fertilisers would be close behind – have you seen the size of some of the “dead” areas in the ocean caused by run-off from the farms? Trouble is, as “unnatural” as farming may be… how else would you sustain the current world’s (human) population? Or would you leave that problem to vaccination and chemotherapy haha?

          • rusty

            Farming has nothing to do with wolves retuning to yellowstone, animal farming is harmful to the environment, farmers could grow plants, nature will look after itself if we stop interfering!

          • Thanks for your opinion doc, but no thanks.

            We can do this without you and your colleagues. In fact, we will prosecute all of you who knew, what, when.

            Go back (start with Old Granny Crow’s list of over 1,000 clinical studies) and educate yourself on Edestin, Albumin, Consumptivitis and Tubercle bacteria from the mid-1850s. You missed that part in school. Or maybe it was the 1947 part on Cannabis extracts and epilepsy.

            QUIT PRACTICING. DO.

            https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/da6fc85d043efbb731e30004d7778d1faa2b50ab66c5e5299620b12e8c5b0f2d.gif

          • “ANY Burned Tar”, Dr. Donald Tashkin, UCLA Institute for Pulmonary Medicine: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJmQ16cGBHU

          • TagMan

            thaddeus – I think the coming TRUE pandemic is Lyme disease. I would rather contract cancer ANY day over Lyme. I’m hoping cannabis might provide some relief theretoo because it is HORRIBLE!

      • Sir that might be the most IDIOT statement I HAVE EVER READ ONLINE.

        1) U.S. physicians are “PRACTICING” and most States FORBID doctors from discussing Cannabis with their patients for ANY MEDICINAL USE.

        2) Western Doctors are NOT EDUCATED in Western Medical Schools, NOR Residency on the Endogenous Cannabinoid Receptor System (ECRS), NOR Cannabis Activated Retrograde Synaptic Signaling (C.A.R.S.S.)

        3) In the absence of Cannabis Science, Chemistry, and Genetics Research – uneducated people say stupid things on the Internet about the subject they are ill-informed.

      • TagMan

        And over 80% of the people who have come to me after you and your ilk sent them home to die because chemo didn’t work and the cancer came back have (coincidentally) be told by their respective hospitals that they don’t have cancer any longer Matthew. I don’t know about cannabis but I DO know that diet and alternative therapies can and DO work. Part of the problem you see is that you guys are TAUGHT by the pharmaceutical companies – they “own” most of the medical schools – and that’s all you know. You know b/all about nutrition and the majority of you think that God walks on your LEFT so hey – what could anyone ELSE know?

      • TagMan

        I’ve only been working with cancer patients for 11 years Matt but my clearnace rate has just moved up to 81% with NO side effects. Most of my clients come from chemo where the cancer has come back (see the reference to the Einstein College of Medicine above) and often they’ve been given 1-6 months to live. Coincidence right? Maybe you need to look outside the box.

      • TagMan

        And I have treated many of those people who were told by your ilk that they would be dead in 1-6 months and 81% of them have now been told by their hospitals that they no longer have cancer Matt, In fact some of the doctors who have bought machines from me have done so BECAUSE they have seen their own patients told BY them that they were going to die, now living normal lives..

    • Erin Elizabeth

      The thing about no sugar….then you can’t have ANY type of sugar. No fruit, no carbs as they convert to sugar. Just look at the diet before you get a PET SCAN (no glucose allowed). Who can live like that? My onco told me cancer will find a way to live, even without sugar….if it where only that simple. Of course healthy living is better for you, but not a cancer cure.

  • Tabitha Tombow

    The simple truth is that, as soon as any therapy shows some promise, it will be swiftly investigated by conventional scientists and doctors. If it then turns out to be successful, the treatment will be used as soon as possible for the benefit of cancer sufferers. Agreed but to get that you need fda approval which gets tricky especially if the drug researchers want to test is a schedule 1 drug so if you can barley test the drug and study it, how in turn can doctors have this option available to them? They can’t so jumping through hoops and low findings create a gap in the system. Not nly that but some fda approved drugs fudge things sometimes and do get caught hee and their or do recalls. True I doubt some household seasoning holds the answer but it would be ludicrous to think in over 50 years in medicine chemotherapy and radiation are still the only option. There are scientists now trying to get the dea to reclassify cannabis because of the overwhelming evidence it can potentially cure most cancer and be more beneficial in numerous illnesses with little to no side effects. So while there are quacks on both sides of the spectrum there needs to be a middle ground no not all science is safe not all government official care to listen and no not all natural ways are best and until science leads instead of having to wait for the dea and fda you will have to take your own health in your own hands reach out to other doctors, biologist, biochemists, and research facilities and see whats going on. If the fda can approve you to be a clinical trial participant (lab rat) then you should be able to choose what experiment you want to be involved in. With you best educated guess and good research done I say do it 🙂 sincerely a daughter to a cancer survivor who only used cannabis oil. After research was done and we spoke non stop to many other doctors, scientists, and other survivors who used it.

    • Acleron

      If cannabis is effective and safe it will just be chemotherapy. However the evidence is not overwhelming. You are quite correct that there are irrational regulations against testing it but that doesn’t add anything to the argument. You will always have informed choice by ethical doctors to take part in a trial, only the charlatans and quacks avoid the regulations.

      • Tabitha Tombow

        Chemotherapy is nothing like cannabis oil. Chemotherapy can create a protein that crates new pathways for other cancer. Cannabis does not. Have you researched cannabis oil what it is and it’s chemical makeup. Other scientists have look up christina Sanchez in madrid spain. She was one of the first to find anticancer and antitumor effects with cbd/tch cannabis oil. Not only that but thousands of people are documented having cancer taking this and no longer having it. What cannabis oil does which is not smoking pot is get into the cancer cell shredding the mitochondria killing the energy source and the cell commits suicide. We also learned and this has been proven we have a gland that secretes this on a minute leven in our body called the endocanabinoid system. The overwhelming evidence came frome other scientists and actually people trying this method first. That’s the evidence not only that it worked on my mom!!! In Louisiana they just legalized the cannabis oil because of this now scientists are trying to get the dea to reschedule it so they can study it more extensively and also so it can be available for mass use and not just people in certain states. Please go research this they have documented cases, researchers that are well known in their field, and people who did it that you can contact. There are so many different things on this it’s really fascinating. From watching the cells die under a microscope after being treated with it, to studies, to survivors, and mist of all doctors not quacks but licensed doctors in great hospitals doing this. It’s more logical to try the least invasive treatment first.

        • Acleron

          So you it’s mostly anecdotal, not convincing at all.

          But if you are impressed by cells dying under a microscope, let me tell you, the difficult thing with cell culture is keeping the damn things alive, killing them is easy.

          As to which treatment to try first, I’ll leave that to expert oncologists. Personally, if I had a fast developing cancer, I’d want the most aggressive treatment first.

          • Tabitha Tombow

            Um that was an example study that was done in 2010 that i already had on my phone lol i was expecting you to do actual research lol. Others already have furthered research on it. It was human tissue of a child under a microscope different thing then what slither i gave also a young boy here with inoperable brain tumor took this road where chemo and radiation failed it was gone in 8 months. Don’t just look at a tiny example i gave and run with it that’s how mistakes happen go look for yourself. Then come back and tell me it does not work. My mom had it for Pete’s sake. And I would choose the best option not just killing cancer and normal cells.

          • Acleron

            What you are giving is exactly the same as all quacks who have ever claimed to have cured anything. Papers that prove nothing and unverifiable anecdotes that often make no sense. When the references are debunked and the anecdotes discarded then we get more of the same.

            Real scientists and doctors demand evidence, we have advanced from the days when every snake oil salesman could freely make money from the unwary. Get the evidence and the scientific community will accept it and incorporate it into treatment systems but get the evidence.

            Until you get such evidence, please stop telling vulnerable people facing devastating and life threatening diseases that you can cure them.

          • Tabitha Tombow

            Reporting their findings in the journal Nature Medicine, the scientists report that the findings were ‘completely unexpected’. Finding evidence of significant DNA damage when examining the effects of chemotherapy on tissue derived from men with prostate cancer, the writings are a big slap in the face to mainstream medical organizations who have been pushing chemotherapy as the only option to cancer patients for years.

            The news comes after it was previously ousted by similarly-breaking research that expensive cancer drugs not only fail to treat tumors, but actually make them far worse. The cancer drugs were found to make tumors ‘metasize’ and grow massively in size after consumption. As a result, the drugs killed the patients more quickly.

            Known as WNT16B, scientists who performed the research say that this protein created from chemo treatment boosts cancer cell survival and is the reason that chemotherapy actually ends lives more quickly. Co-author Peter Nelson of the Fred Hutchinson Cancer Research Center in Seattle explains:

            “WNT16B, when secreted, would interact with nearby tumour cells and cause them to grow, invade, and importantly, resist subsequent therapy.”
            The team then complimented the statement with a word of their own:

            “Our results indicate that damage responses in benign cells… may directly contribute to enhanced tumour growth kinetics.”

          • Acleron

            So still misunderstanding that all drugs are chemotherapy. That means your cannabis oil does the same. Fortunately scientists and doctors understand just a little more than either journalists or you. If this was a general effect then why do clinical trials show that some drugs are effective?

            By the way, all accepted chemotherapy could be invalid, it isn’t but let us assume it was for the moment. It still doesn’t provide evidence for cannabis oil. Denigrating existing treatments to bolster sales of quackery is yet another tactic of quacks.

            Where are the double blinded trials that show your pet treatment is effective?

          • Tabitha Tombow

            I’m mearly showing the vulnerability in the existing one’s and when I say chemo I hope you are understanding that I mean the chemotherapy drug currently used for cancer and not all chemical compounds that can be used fir all drugs. Now if you would like to speak to a biochemist studying these things and working with doctors and cancer patients in madrid spain her name is Christina Sanchez you can google her and find her research center with a telephone number and email. She’s been doing the studies gor over 12 years now as for all other research well you don’t pay me to do it and it takes time. You can simply do that on your own time if you are passionate about it. Like I said before I have personally seen it work and have personally seen 5 die from the treatment given by doctors now before the cancer could be cured I mean living the success rate time given. Have a good night and happy hunting.

          • Acleron

            I’m disinterested in passion as a modus operandi for clinical research. You have shown that you cannot debate the ‘evidence’ you produced yet still make extravagant claims. Why don’t you learn the science of research so you can understand what kind of evidence is required. It is not easy and you won’t acquire that knowledge by only reading things you believe.

          • TagMan

            Tabitha – acles is the consummate academic… can spout crap to the moon and beyond but has not an OUNCE of real world understanding of ANYTHING. If it hasn’t been ‘tested in a lab – it isn’t real har har.
            Acleron – I am bowing out for two reasons – 1. You can’t talk sense to a member of any cult, and 2. the ONLY thing in this world that you can’t replace – is your time and I have given WAY too generously of my time to you. You accuse EVERYONE with an opposing view, of not answering your questions, yet you have not answered a single on of mine. All you have done is to accuse based SOLELY on your own inability to grasp anything that is a mm outside of your understanding.
            For your information – people typically come to me when all hope has been removed – they have been given 1-6 months to live by your infallable medical “profession” and it is not until the HOSPITAL tells them the cancer is gone that I stop treatment!

            So the 81% that are now free of cancer in SPITE of what they were told – you in your UNBELIEVABLE arrogance would have denied the opportunity because it doesn’t meet YOUR “testing” requirements you “holier than thou” piece of shit…

            You have accused me of a being a “snake oil salesman yet I DON’T CHARGE for my services, and I don’t make enough to survive on the profit i make on providing machines – IF they want their OWN!!! If they want to leave a donation I gratefully accept that but I DON’T CHARGE! How many people’s lives have YOU saved acles? What do YOU do – FREE OF CHARGE to help your fellow human being.

            I never thought I would EVER say this but I hope you are gifted with the learning of receviing cancer and all that goes with it – SOON – that is the scum level that you rate! Have a happy life with your SEVERELY limited views mate.

          • Tabitha Tombow

            But if you haven’t thoroughly researched the topic I don’t see hiw you can dismiss it or even discuss it.

          • Acleron

            I don’t need to read about it to refute your claims, Your lack of evidence is sufficient in itself. By the way, telling a critic to do their own research is pretty much the red flag of accepting you have no evidence.

          • Tabitha Tombow

            You do know the scientific community are researching this with great expectations. Another point there was no snake salesman in my moms treatment she grew the cannabis herself and we made the oil ourselves. The scientists studying it are very much professionals they are researching it so are you saying that these scientists are not real because they are not studying chemo and radiation? What about documented cases of it working like my mom. What about the scientists saying hey there is something here we are talking about real research happening, real doctors and patients asking senetors to legalize this real political figures arguing the DEA in court if its such quackery then why are doctors, scientists, and politicians asking for legalization of this drug so it can be used. Also they are continuously finding flaws in chemo and radiation research. I’m a science person and a logical one. I do not take the word of a random person on the street I also am well aware doctors, scientists, and the dea are run by human beings and to say they have no error is a folly so until you find proof chemo and radiation have a 50% cure raye not a 5-10 simi cure rate then that will not be my first option after seeing cannabis oil work for 2 people I know and countless other I contact.

          • Acleron

            Fine, do the studies, but until such time as those studies are published and accepted, stop making claims based on nothing but unverifiable anecdotes and papers that do not prove effectiveness in humans.

            Yeah, I bet you have contacted people that have survived cancer. I bet you haven’t spoken to those who didn’t. And that is the main problem with your irresponsible claims based on nothing.

            There may indeed be something useful in cannabis plants but prove it, don’t make unsubstantiated claims that may convince people to avoid treatment that has been shown to be effective.

          • charlie

            You make great a few good points here and there but your overall view is an ignorant one. Not supporting a potential treatment for cancer without clinical studies is understandable but the fact of the matter is approved treatments are extremely underwhelming and a pure gamble to many who are diagnosed with cancer.

            Western medicine is inexcusably behind the 8 ball on researching possible benefits of marijuana. And people are coming out of the woodwork with tales of being cured and loved ones being cured on thc treatments alone. The studies already done show promise. So I ask you, for a late stage cancer patient who’s percentages are not very good with approved treatments, which gamble do you take. The one that debilitates you and probably won’t work or the one that doesn’t and probably won’t work.

            If my grandfather decided to try the thc method and he was somehow cancer free after time, I would be on every website stating what he had done and that it worked for him. That would not make me a quack nor would I would I be making claims based on nothing as you so told Tabitha. It would be the truth. My Pap did this and then he was cancer free. Give it a shot if you don’t like your odds.

            You tell Tabitha to prove it but you know that is impossible for her to do for you. So you’re kinda just being a prick. That seems to be your complete MO as I can see from this thread. Kind of a stubborn mule. Not proven in USA labs, your irresponsible blah blah blah over and over again. It seems irresponsible of you as a man of medicine to be dismissive of anything not unrestricted by the FDA then proven useful in the lab.

            I understand why you say the things you do because there are sooo many supposed cures out there in internetland and if I bought every one for my Pap he wouldn’t use a quarter the crap and I’d have given money to at least a few total pieces of trash. But when people are dying and the FDA and pharmaceutical companies have the track record they have and the current treatments totally suck for some types of cancers it would be irresponsible of anyone to not post to the world what worked for them as long as they are being completely honest in what all treatments they used.

          • Acleron

            ‘as long as they are being completely honest in what all treatments they used.’

            As if.

          • charlie

            You have selective cynicism. Of course there are folk who get chemotherapy while drinking red clover tea then swear that the red clover tea cured them but not everyone who is into alternative medicine is a jackass. C’mon fella get real. My father has prostate cancer and they immediately told him surgery.He opted not too(incontinence and impotence did not sound appealing) He’s been on an almost natural diet for 5 years and has much lower PSA levels than initially. Coincidence, possibly but common sense says it probably helped.

          • Acleron

            The number of times I’ve been given an anecdote that falls apart on examination convinces me that they are useless as evidence. Spontaneous remission is known, attributing it to whatever non medicine is around is a fallacy.

          • charlie

            I certainly believe that most cure claims turn out to be false however when conventional medicine is debilitating and results are discouraging then there is nothing wrong with trying alternative medicines. Anyone claiming it is a sure-fire cure is wrong but stating what you tried and what your results are is helpful as to light a fire for clinical studies under whatever treatment you tried. Attributing it to whatever alternative medicine is around is not a fallacy. It’s just probably a fallacy. And I believe there is always a reason for remission, we’re just not able to figure out why most times or simply don’t look into it.

          • Acleron

            Attributing to whichever quackery is in vogue is definitely a fallacy. There is no value in these anecdotes for making decisions. By encouraging people to try it you can delay effective treatment with fatal results. If pharmaceutical companies try to market drugs with such a lack of evidence, they are roundly condemned and quite right too. We have learned, painfully, that drawing conclusions without solid evidence is futile and in the case of medicine, dangerous.

          • charlie

            You use the word quackery wrong. If someone is saying this cured me and will cure you then sure. If someone says I did these things and now I this happened, it is simply stating facts. If you believe no one should ever try anything that isn’t approved by the medical field when they are sick then well you just sound like a typical doctor who will pocket money every time I start to have a MRSA outbreak(with self convinced good intentions). Fortunately for me, I looked up alternative medicines and now I put make a poultice with tea tree oil, oregano oil and grapefruit seed extract and the infection goes away. If the infection got worse I would go have to see a doctor and help MRSA become more resistant to antibiotics.

            I’m not trying to change your mind. You obviously believe wholeheartedly that trying alternative medicine is downright stupid. But intelligent people will still research and try things that could work but not proven to instead of trying something that could work and is proven to only possibly work.

            “Gunshot victim who refused hospital treatment died last night from gunshot wound” (George Carlin) People can become too cynical of the medical system and be downright ignorant. However, the American medical society most certainly does not always know best and is a money driven corrupt system.

          • Acleron

            If someone says I was doing this and I also had remission from disease/condition X then that would be accurate. By saying I was cured by this it is fallacious, nobody could know. It is a combination of cognitive bias and the cum hoc ergo proper hoc fallacy.

          • TagMan

            OH COME ON ACCLES Stand up – be a MAN and DEMONSTRATE your undying confiction that nothing works until a “peer reviewed study” says it does by shooting yourself in the head. Do it on Facebook so we can all see the result and you will have abject believers from here on. In the event that you are right – I PERSONALLY will revoke EVERYTHING i’ve said about you and will be a devoted follower from here on. Lets DO it… And if you WON’T, then you prove EVERYTHING i have said about you – you are a COMPLETE hypocrite!

          • Acleron

            So says the conman with no evidence.

          • TagMan

            Yes – let your babies die, watch your parents fade away under chemotherapy but KNOW AS AN ABSOLUTE… cannabis CANNOT CURE until a “peer reviewed study” SAYS it can. See how “smart” they are?

          • Acleron

            You might try a course in remedial reading, you need one.

          • TagMan

            Tabitha – you are wasting your time with these cretins. They are professional debaters (shit stirrers) only. They don’t know anything about anything – they just keep repeating their “peer study” crap OVER AND OVER and yet even though there is NO peer reviewed study to confirm that bullets in the head will kill you almost EVERY time – not ONE of the great unbelievers has been willing to stand behind their theory and take one. The biggest hypocrites on the planet.

          • AutismDadd

            When it comes to debating guys like Mike acleron, brian, joe, tom etc are masters. They may be doing it as they post.

          • Tabitha Tombow

            By the way everything starts with cells, cells are very impressive.

          • Tabitha Tombow

            Cannabis Oil Brain Tumor Remission by Jeffrey Dach MD
            screen-shot-2013-04-23-at-4-01-45-amCannabis Oil Brain Tumor Remission by Jeffrey Dach MD

            Dr. William Courtney was interviewed by the Huffington Post and talked about an 8 month old baby suffering from a malignant brain tumor (see MRI images at left).(2)

            The parents declined conventional treatment with chemotherapy, and used cannabis oil (medical marijuana) instead. Miraculously, after two months of cannabis oil, the MRI scan showed dramatic improvement. “They were putting cannabinoid oil on the baby’s pacifier twice a day, increasing the dose… And within two months there was a dramatic reduction.”(2)

            The initial MRI scan at the upper left frame showed typical features of an inoperable brain tumor, with features of a “butterfly glioma” with invasion of the corpus callosum and spread across the midline, At 2 months, the follow up MRI scan shows regression of tumor, and at 4 and 8 months the scans show complete clearing, and are totally clean.

            This is Highly Significant

            Butterfly malignant gliomas are highly aggressive tumors, and poorly responsive to conventional chemotherapy and radiation treatment. I can tell you this type of response is never seen with conventional treatment. In my opinion this type of response is highly significant.

            Dr Courtney says: “The child is a miracle baby…. we should be insisting this is frontline therapy for all children before using medications that have horrific long term side effects. (such as chemo).”(2)

            Cannabis Oil is Non-Psychoactive

            The two active ingredients in cannabis are the psycho-active component called THC, and the non-psychoactive component called cannabidiol, found in cannabis oil.(9)

            Research Showing Cannabis Has Potent Anticancer Activity (4-11)

            How does it work ? Cannabis oil causes stress to the endoplasmic reticulum in the cancer cells. This causes the cancer dells to undergo self programmed cell death, called apoptosis. This selectively kills the cancer cells, while leaving the normal tissue unharmed.(4-11)

            “Endoplasmic Reticulum (ER) stress–evoked upregulation of the p8/TRB3 pathway induced autophagy via inhibition of the Akt/mTORC1 axis and that activation of autophagy promoted the apoptotic death of tumor cells. The uncovering of this pathway, which we believe is novel, for promoting tumor cell death may have therapeutic implications in the treatment of cancer”(4) quote from Dr. María Salazar.

            Clinical Trials are underway funded by GW Pharmaceuticals for the treatment of Recurrent Glioblastoma Multiforme (GBM) in 20 patients:

            “pre-clinical research conducted by GW has demonstrated cannabinoids inhibit the viability of glioma cells both in vitro and in vivoi,ii via apoptosis or programmed cell death. GW has identified the putative mechanism of action for our cannabinoid product candidate, where autophagy and programmed cell death are stimulated via stimulation of the TRB3 pathway. ” PRNews and that’s one of thousands

          • Acleron

            You seem to have forgotten to mention that Jeffrey Dach sells many wacko things to cure you of all ills. This includes bioidentical hormones, lol, these are known as hormones, he was also very keen on telling you how to pay for his stuff.

            William Courtney runs an outfit called Cannabis International Foundation, I wonder what he sells.

            Spontaneous remissions from cancer are well known, these people never show the anecdotes where their treatment failed and that is why relying on anecdotes is futile.

          • Tabitha Tombow

            I’m trying to upload the scan

      • Tabitha Tombow

        stractSend to:
        Pharmacology. 2010;85(6):328-35. doi: 10.1159/000312686. Epub 2010 Jun 2.
        Cannabinoids inhibit cellular respiration of human oral cancer cells.
        Whyte DA1, Al-Hammadi S, Balhaj G, Brown OM, Penefsky HS, Souid AK.
        Author information
        Abstract
        BACKGROUND AND PURPOSE:
        The primary cannabinoids, Delta(9)-tetrahydrocannabinol (Delta(9)-THC) and Delta(8)-tetrahydrocannabinol (Delta(8)-THC) are known to disturb the mitochondrial function and possess antitumor activities. These observations prompted us to investigate their effects on the mitochondrial O(2) consumption in human oral cancer cells (Tu183). This epithelial cell line overexpresses bcl-2 and is highly resistant to anticancer drugs.
        EXPERIMENTAL APPROACH:
        A phosphorescence analyzer that measures the time-dependence of O(2) concentration in cellular or mitochondrial suspensions was used for this purpose.
        KEY RESULTS:
        A rapid decline in the rate of respiration was observed when Delta(9)-THC or Delta(8)-THC was added to the cells. The inhibition was concentration-dependent, and Delta(9)-THC was the more potent of the two compounds. Anandamide (an endocannabinoid) was ineffective; suggesting the effects of Delta(9)-THC and Delta(8)-THC were not mediated by the cannabinoidreceptors. Inhibition of O(2) consumption by cyanide confirmed the oxidations occurred in the mitochondrial respiratory chain. Delta(9)-THC inhibited the respiration of isolated mitochondria from beef heart.
        CONCLUSIONS AND IMPLICATIONS:
        These results show the cannabinoids are potent inhibitors of Tu183 cellular respiration and are toxic to this highly malignant tumor.
        PMID: 20516734 [PubMed – indexed for MEDLINE] that is just one research finding there are many plus many cancer survivors that have only used this method. There are states legalizing this because of the overwhelming evidence brought by scientists, researchers and people who actually did this like my mom who were documented having cancer doing this and are now cancer free go research this its fascinating stuff from watching cancer cells die under a microscope from this, to talking to people who did this and are cancer free, there is just so much out there that in the united states they are legalizing it all we need is the dea to reclassify it so science and research can continue.

        • Acleron

          This is precisely the type of misinformation used by quacks to sell their product, whether it be the actual chemical or just books.

          The researchers have only shown that at some dose, mitochondrial respiration is inhibited. So what? Many toxic materials do the same. The bit that is missing is showing that this only happens to transformed cells and not to normal cells. Even then, experiments in cell culture are a long way from a therapy in humans. Next, precise dosages in animal models have to be established and then toxicity studies, both will need characterised materials, cannabis oil is not a standard material. Finally, phase one studies in humans can begin, these will show tolerance and gross toxicity. Phase two studies will be used to establish the dose and the delivery system. Phase three studies will then show the effectiveness of the final product.

          Only in lala land do you miss out all these steps because someone takes anecdotes instead of real, hard evidence. Experience has shown that no matter how promising a drug appears at any stage it is likely to fail a later one.

      • Tabitha Tombow

        Also chemotherapy is not cannabis oil it has already been found that chemotherapy creates a protein that can cause new cancer growth its even in medical billing and coding books. Cbd/tch (cannabis oil) is nothing like chemotherapy

        • Acleron

          The clue is in the name, chemotherapy. The name was originally used to describe all drug therapies but now only applies to drugs used in oncology.

  • Mr Harry Ferguson

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  • BJH

    Every MD, Biologist, Chemist and Researcher needs to watch and study the work of Dr. Raphael Mechoulam of the Hebrew University in Jerusalem, Israel. Watch this film about his research of cannabis and the endocannabinoid system. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=csbJnBKqwIw

    The National Cancer Institute acknowledged the anti-cancerous effects of cannabis. https://www.cancer.gov/about-cancer/treatment/cam/hp/cannabis-pdq

    You may also be interested in the research of Dr. Guillermo Velasco and Dr. Manuel Guzmán. They published research in 1998 that showed how tetrahydrocannabinol (THC) induces apoptosis in glioma cells. In 2011 they demonstrated THC even works with chemotherapy to kill brain cancer. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/9771884/
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/21220494/

    They’re raising money to conduct clinical human trials in Madrid, Spain. You can read more about Dr. Guzman here. http://cannabis-med.org/index.php?tpl=faq&red=faqlist&id=274&lng=en

    There is much more to this discussion, critical information that has seemed to escape the awareness of the author and many commentators.

  • Claire Anderson

    I want to thank Dr. Daniel Floyd and all the management of Dr. Daniel Floyd Pharmaceuticals their life saving cannabis oil cured my wife of thyroid cancer , the doctor told me there was little they could do and despite all the chemotherapy and radiation, she was not responding to treatment. so a friend of mine came to our rescue by ordering the cannabis oil from Dr. Daniel pharmaceutical. Which actually is established by one of the students of Rick Simpson, covered by the legal certification of Rick Simpson. Dr. Daniel Floyd has been helping patients fight cancer of various types, as it is almost impossible to reach Rick Simpson himself on time. So we decided give it a try, so far my wife is improving very well and today she can walk around the house all by herself. I believe it is necessary to let others, especially those suffering from this acute disease that once you have this oil, it can really give a second chance at life. If you happen to be in need of this oil, should contact the via this email: drdanielfloyd@gmail.com

  • Sarah Chukovski

    i am grateful to Dr. Daniel Floyd and all the management of Dr. Daniel Floyd Pharmaceuticals their life saving cannabis oil cured my wife of thyroid cancer , the doctor told me there was little they could do and despite all the chemotherapy and radiation, she was not responding to treatment. so a friend of mine came to our rescue by ordering the cannabis oil from Dr. Daniel pharmaceutical. Which actually is established by one of the students of Rick Simpson, covered by the legal certification of Rick Simpson. Dr. Daniel Floyd has been helping patients fight cancer of various types, as it is almost impossible to reach Rick Simpson himself on time. So we decided give it a try, so far my wife is improving very well and today she can walk around the house all by herself. I believe it is necessary to let others, especially those suffering from this acute disease that once you have this oil, it can really give a second chance at life. If you happen to be in need of this oil, should contact the via this email: drdanielfloyd@gmail.com

  • jhsif

    The moral of the sotry boys and girls nuclear radiaiton from CHEMO is the only CURE oops I mean FDA APPROVED treatment, (even though anti nuke nuts have been SCREAMING against nukes it’s perfectly acceptable and even CRIMINAL to not FORCE your child to mainline nuclear waste to cure OOPS I mean (giggle) TREAT their cancer. Apparently other cures for cancer are, dress them up like superheros, give them a ride in a limosine, give them WHATEVER their hearts DESIRE just NOT a CURE for their disease from the so called MAKE a WISH or as I call it INSULT a SICK CHILD TO THEIR FACE BY REFUSING A CURE FOUNDATION!

  • Ree Zun
  • Franklin Welsh

    TESTIMONY OF HOW I CURED MY CANCER!
    Hey! I can,t believe this. A great testimony that i must share to all cancer patient in the world i never believed that their could be any complete cure for lung cancer or any cancer,i saw people testimony on blog sites of how Dr Rick Simpson cannabis oil brought them back to life again. i had to try it too and you can,t believe that in just few weeks i started using it all my pains stop gradually and i had to leave without the drugs the doctor gave to me. Right now i can tell you that few months now i have not had any pain, and i have just went for text last week and the doctor confirmed that there is no trace of any cancer system. Glory be to God for leading me to this genuine Man Dr Rick Simpson. I am so happy as i am sharing this testimony. My advice to you all who thinks that their is no cure for cancer that is Not true, just contact him and get cannabis oil from Dr Rick Simpson to cure your cancer and you will be free and free for ever, Try it and you will not regret it because it truly works. One thing i have come to realize is that you never know how true it is until you try. There is no harm in trying. Remember, delay in treatment leads to death. Here is his email:(rickcannabisoil19@gmail.com)Contact him and be free from cancer!

  • g8 connect

    CBD oil from hemp or hemp oil has real low amounts of cbds and thc. The CBD oil the guys are legalizing is from strains grown from low thc >1% high CBD 20-25% such as the “Charolettes Web strain from colcorado.. You cannot get high smoking CBD Oil. It only works when ingested. For details to order some canabis oil. contact richardbutle9@gmail.com will kill strong sterm cells like cancer

    • thaddeusbuttmunchmd

      Yes, and it’s Ironic that while the folks in the States which are legalizing Weed, the Cheech & Chong types want the highest possible THC, not CBD. THC is Good for anxiety and nausea, CBD is Good for appetite, pain, and probably killing malignant (Cancer) cells. ALL Cannabinoids are neuroprotective in the Brain (Despite the “Reefer Madness” nonsense.)

      • omfgwtfbbq

        The Charolette’s web strain is from colorado. It has 0.5% THC. Did you even read his comment? Also, CBD targets only the CB2 receptor while THC targets the CB1 receptor. Some cancers have CB1 only receptors (requiring high thc), some cancers have only CB2 receptors (requiring high CBD), some cancers have CB1 and CB2 receptors. There are also 100+ other cannabinoids which haven’t even been isolated for pre-clinical testing yet.

      • CharlaS

        Cannabis boosts endogenous (occurring naturally within the body) ceramide production according to Dennis Hill, a biochemist who worked at MD Anderson Cancer Center in Texas who cleared stage 4 prostate cancer using no other treatments except cannabis oil. National Institutes of Health research shows that it is specifically the THC portion of cannabis that boosts ceramide levels. People who develop cancer are shown to be deficient in ceramide. Smoking cannabis does not deliver the required levels of THC, but using the oil orally or rectally as suppositories does. Other cannabinoids are still being tested to find out their specific medicinal qualities. Studies are under way using synthesized nano-ceramide to cure cancer. Why not just boost ceramide naturally? Dennis Hill’s stage 4 cancer was completely gone in 6 months and he has stayed clear for over 7 years.

  • Robert S Redfern

    The problem with humans is they are very creative and create self and group delusion that is very hard to move. That is why all cancer studies (and all health studies) must be supervised by retired aeronautical engineers. They have no axe to grind and they have nearly 100% success record for safety, outcomes and science. Of course Curcumin and all of the other alternatives can be tested since all of the sufferers will be volunteers the same as with pharma drugs.

    • Acleron

      Is this the thinking of a retired engineer?

    • JoeFarmer

      You might want to rethink that suggestion. Not much life science study in engineering programs like AeroE.

      • Robert S Redfern

        I cannot think of another group of honest people with a nearly 100% safety record I trust to oversee such studies. Do you know of anyone?

        • JoeFarmer

          First, you need to acknowledge that the exemplary record of airlines goes far beyond the people designing the aircraft. For instance the concept of Crew Resource Management.

          Second, any supervisory or oversight operation needs to be done by people with subject matter experience. AeroE people aren’t going to have that.

          • Robert S Redfern

            I guess you cannot recommend an alternative honest group to audit the results. I guess we will have to reply on bribery and corruption and keep applying huge fines for their fixed results.

          • Robert S Redfern

            Yes but the existing overseers with experience have been found to be faking and hiding the true results and have been fined billions but they are so wealthy from their ill gotten gains they pay the fines and carry on.

    • I agree.

      I also think that all flight dynamics studies of aircraft must be supervised by retired podiatrists. They have no axe to grind and they have nearly 100% success record for safety, plus they aren’t in the pocket of Big Aero.

      Of course Turkey Feather and Wax Wings and all of the other alternatives can be tested on volunteers… or prisoners.

      • Robert S Redfern

        Were you putting a foot in your mouth or dipping your toe into the wax to make it sound funny? Or was that the feathers tickling your fancy?

        • I was being just as serious as you, Robert S Redfern.
          My proposition is just as logical and well considered as yours and it will insure aircraft safety because podiatrists will have no conflicts of interest with the aircraft industry. We will select only podiatrists who travel by train.

          What will you do to make sure your aeronautical engineers have no connection to the pharmaceutical industry? Select only AEs that have never visited a doctor or purchased OTC drugs?

          Edited to add:
          My team of aircraft safety studies supervisors populated exclusively by podiatrists will be named… Icarus, thus explaining for the unschooled the feathers and wax allusion in my first post.

          • Robert S Redfern

            Well, if we are being serious, podiatrists while giving a good service do not have the lives of millions in their hands everyday (unlike aeronautical engineers).
            As I am typing this, once again, a report is on the BBC of the side effects of a drug that damaged thousand of babies in the womb. The report claims that these side effects were hidden by the manufacturers and doctors. This is shown to be normal practice in the medical business in spite of £billions paid in fines for this type of practice.
            Just two weeks after GSK were fined the largest fine in history (3billion) the head of that company (with a big fat donation cheque in his hand) was welcomed by David Conman
            Can you imagine the manufacturers and aeronautical engineers hiding major faults in planes resulting in thousands of death and injuries every year? Would you fly anywhere?
            The aeronautical business welcomes those who report faults as heroes. The medical business sacks minions that report problems but mounts massive witch hunts against highly qualified doctors who dare to go public.
            I seriously stand for my claim that retired aeronautical engineers are the best supervisors of this corrupt industry. Better still it is time we jailed anyone (Alternative of Orthodox) who takes part in the coverup of the terrible side effects of harmful treatments and inappropriate practices.

          • What about the naval engineers who design and engineer submarines? They go down all the time but you never hear of them because they fail when the vessel is out of sight and reports of their loss is hidden by the NWO Aluminutty. Would you ever get on a submarine designed by engineers? They should all be designed by epidemiologists.

            How can you trust any engineers, including AEs, when it’s obvious they all work for the NWO and are all compromised. They’ve all sold their souls and your loved one’s lives for the price of a steak dinner with drinks and a really nice pocket protector.

            Your idea to have AEs supervise an industry of which they have absolutely no knowledge is perhaps the most insane idea I’ve heard in the last couple days… this being the internet and land of the crackpot conspiracy loonies. I wouldn’t trust any aeronautical engineer to supervise anything beyond stuffing envelopes and even there they’re liable to kill someone from paper cuts.

          • Acleron

            Engineering firms don’t cover up mistakes? The Challenger shuttle disaster is one example. There was a systematic suppression of the direct and indirect causes of that, spectacularly exposed by R. Feynman.

            The idea that people with no knowledge of an area supervise it is not sensible. An aeronautical engineer that became a clinical trial specialist would be OK but according to Robert S Redfern would become corrupt.

          • And they didn’t even give Feynman a free pocket protector or mechanical pencil. They knew he was dying of cancer when he was investigating the frozen stiff O-rings and just let him die instead of giving him their NWO sooper sekrit kancer kure which, even now, is enabling the MIB to live to ages not seen since Methuselah.
            I think Bill Gates was involved in that assassination but I’d have to check his TED talk because criminal eevyil geniuses always publicly reveal their plans and crimes just like in the comic books and hollywood fantasy films.

          • Acleron

            Even after he disclosed the reason for the disaster, creeping safety standards leading to the O-ring problem, he had to publish a minority, dissenting report.

            Wow, this must mean that all engineers are corrupt.

            In fact, all the problems with pharmaceutical drugs have been disclosed by other clinical researchers, none by engineers.

          • Robert S Redfern

            OK you beat me. I will keep going to private doctors with whom I discuss the science and study of healthcare for my future. I wish you well since you don’t seem to bother to answer me about the crimes of the pharma led doctors/researchers and therefore presume you approve of them.

          • Robert S Redfern said, “OK you beat me. I will keep going to private doctors…”

            Doctors!? Doctors?
            Why would someone like you want to go to a doctor.
            Surely you can find a retired sanitation engineer to give you your annual physical and prostate exam.
            They are much more reliable and untainted by conspiracy theory than a big pHARMA doctor.

          • Robert S Redfern

            Your reply makes my point much better than I can.

          • TagMan

            They never answer ANYTHING Robert – they just accuse everyone ELSE of not answering. I have never encountered a lower echelon of scum as I have in this column.

          • Robert S Redfern

            Calm down, these sheeple followers of the cult of the medical mafia will be dead long before you and me and I am 72.

  • thaddeusbuttmunchmd

    The “Rife Machine” probably NEVER works. BUT-a more recent innovation (not Alternative, but invented by an Engineer) is the Kanzius Machine. This treatment involves being injected with Gold Nanoparticles, and then being placed in an alternating magnetic field. The inventor used a Crude Homebuilt machine and, tragically, Lost his Battle with the Disease. But this machine has been tested on pigs, and is at least Safe. The mechanism of action is that the Gold particles (hopefully) concentrate in the Tumor. Then the Magnetic Field “Cooks” the tumors-like an induction Stove, without causing too much damage to surrounding tissue. It IS an Issue that the New Treatments take so long to be approved (in the US-by the FDA.) Chemotherapy and Radiation Therapy are Far more Dangerous, and target ALL rapidly dividing cells, e.g. The Bone Marrow, the Lining of the Gut, and the Hair Follicles.

    • TagMan

      TOTALLY…WRONG! There is actually no such thing as a “Rife machine,” Rife was not about a machine he was about the concept that if everything is enrgy (the ONLY thing that ALL scientists agree on) then if you could find the life frequency of a pathogen, you should be able to blow it up by hitting it with the same frequency under power. And he PROVED it after building the world’s first microscope powerful enough to SEE a living cell. So Rife DOES work – ask any of the MANY people whom I have taken from death’s door. Please understand things before decrying them.

      • thaddeusbuttmunchmd

        Yeah-and we Evil physicians repress it so we can give Chemo instead. Our own loved ones Die of Cancer, Too, you know.

        • TagMan

          Yes because you are too brainwashed to look at anything else. I do have doctors buying machines form me now so maybe it is changing.

  • GARY JEFFERSON

    Unfortunately, this article is another form of “snake oil.” Oncologist get paid a fee for every chemo patient they treat. Research is what I do. I have cancer and I use naturopathy to treat myself. It’s been two years since I was diagnosed with advanced prostate cancer. I took the hormone therapy “ADT” (pills for 1 month) then the first double dose shot. Within a month I had bonafide research that proves you sir are a liar just like the rest of the allopathic doctors controlled by the FDA/AMA/Big Pharma. Unlike you sir, I have a law degree (health law) along with an EXTENSIVE premed-background. Studies from the NIH prove much of what you say is false. If so much of what’s on the internet is “snake oil” then why is immunotherapy/immunochemotherapy/immuno-oncology the newest developments? They’re aimed at combining your drugs (the real culprit) with naturopathy. Why? Because chemo and radiation are carcinogens (cancer producing agents) that kill both cancerous and healthy cells; thus destroying the immune system which kills cancer cells on a daily basis until compromised. Naturopathy is aimed at revitalizing the immune system while also killing cancer cells without doing harm to healthy ones.

    Thus, anyone with common sense should beg to differ that treating cancer with cancer is “sane.” No sir, it’s barbaric. The informed also know that traditional allopathic treatments cause the cancer to be more viral and resistant, thus the lousy survival rate; more than 70% and many studies will show that 97% of the traditional treatment is a complete failure. The only thing accurate in your assessment is that there is [no cure in allopathic medicine]. I can’t tell you how many oncologists have tried to come after me online for sharing this information. The problem is, debate is what I do; I’ve made history and if you cannot debate a single topic for 20 years “like me”… I will toast your ass. Thus, they all end up running away after an encounter with me. Not only that, they get angry and belligerent because they know the truth will take money out of their “trillion dollar con game.”

    Yeah, you have no problem with using herbs to develop a “synthetic drug” but naturopathy works without all the dangerous side effects of “synthetic drugs”… Like ADT causes heart attacks directly related to the testosterone levels being decreased. It also makes you susceptible to blood clots…thrombosis…both of which I had. So what’s the common sense in giving a prostate cancer patient who has blood clots already (prevalent with pc as you should know) ADT? No response necessary. You also know that allopathic physicians are prevented from advocating anything other than “allopathy” under the AMA/FDA guidelines. Thus, they can be fired if they do. It’s an obvious conflict of interest where the oncologist’s financial well being takes precedence to the patient’s.

    Before and/or if you respond to me I suggest you view two links: http://www.legaldee.com
    and my own treatment protocol varied by facts…not snake oil as you say… https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/jefferson-chronicle-gary-jefferson-6029320874757214209

    My Areas of Expertise:

    Health Law

    Health care law focuses on the legislative, executive, and judicial rules and regulations that govern the health care industry. The health care industry includes hospitals and hospital systems, public and private insurers, pharmaceutical and device manufacturers, and the individual practitioners who treat patients. Each of these entities functions within a vast complex of laws and regulations, and the curriculum reflects this complexity by offering a variety of courses that focus on specific aspects of health care law, such as fraud and abuse, food and drug law, medical malpractice, and healthcare mergers and acquisitions.

    Administrative Law
    Employment Law
    Federal Employees’ Compensation Act
    Federal Tort Claims Act
    RICO Act

  • Filipe Ramos
  • Zed O’Roq

    i’ve been asking among my friends, acquaintances and in forums, and i have a database with more or less 250 cases of cancer patients. i asked them how long they’ve been living or how long did they live, and what kind of treatment they or their friends had. 40% of patients treated only with conventional medicine survive the first 5 years after diagnosis, 57% of patients who combine it with an alternative treatment survive, and 82% of the patients who interrupt conventional treatment or never had it survive. of course 250 patients arnt that much to be exact, but it shows the direction. the difrence is much grater when in comes to vital organs, ware conventional medicine shows a survival rate of 1% to 20%, while alternativ medicin is still around 65%. and patients treeted with alternativ medicin rarely hav recurrences.
    the substances and methods for which i’v seen mor survivors and studdies ar cannabis, macrobiotics, mistletoe, laetrile (vitamin b17).
    for cannabis i found 141 studdies, in vitro, in vivo and epidemiological ones. but the medical establishment ses that thare ar no studdies, becaus thare ar no clinical studdies – as if any other study was of no value, as if the many thousands of studdies made evry yeer in the world wer of no value. but now thare has been eeven a clinical studdy, conducted by gw research in the UK: https://www.gwpharm.com/about-us/news/gw-pharmaceuticals-achieves-positive-results-phase-2-proof-concept-study-glioma.
    thare hasnt been much meedia about it, and i can imagin wy. the meedia doesnt want to lose clients, and they know wat big farma and the industry of medical macheens dont like.

  • Nelly Takis

    If conventional medicine would have finally managed to cure cancer after decades of research and billions invested, desperate patients and their families would not be looking for alternative cures. Fact is that their only weapons for decades has been chemo and radiation that do not cure cancer but extend the lifespan. I have yet to meet anyone who has not died from this horrible disease using the conventional protocol, apart from some breast cancer patients who managed well and are still alive. Chemo can benefit mostly blood tumors ( leukemia and lymphomas) but with solid tumors does very little… And not everyone is lucky enough to be diagnosed stage 1.. Conventional medicine cannot stop recurrences and metastases which eventually kill the patient. Its a big shame that after d